'Official' F12M Rumours and Launch

Since they are profit-oriented company (logically) it would be silly not to use already developed digital dash from LaF.

Gigantic analog tach is past, that was shown on LaF.

 

I think you're right. Maybe that will be one of the display modes. I just would like to see more interior differentiation between the models. But then again, I am not in the business of selling cars...

 

Modular design is currently present in automotive industry. Spreading easentially the same parts through whole model range is great way of gaining huge profit. Thats why you see similar lights, body panels, handles, controls etc.

Negative effect is that all models are somehow similar, but seems that buyers are okay with that.

If you want differentiation you must go to small manufacturers like Pagani, but that is pretty expensive game.

 

I agree with you, but for small volume manufacturers like Ferrari modular design is the only way to stay profitable, but still delivering highly advanced cars. It is not matter of choice for them, it is matter of "to be or not to be".

One example: Ferrari`s V12 from Enzo is in usage for almost 15 years. Imagine the level of development and engineering modularity in mind from that time. They had to make highly modular engine core in order to reduce costs for V12 R&D for every new V12 model that came after Enzo.

They introduced V8TT with 488 GTB. As you can see, that engine found its place in multiple models already.

Same goes with lights that were introduced with 458 and later used in all other models, steering wheel, screens, seats etc.

 

Sounds very logical, also the case with most low volume auto makers today .

 

Sounds like there is a hybrid with KERS drivetrain. When the black f12 passes the camera at 1:05 the engine is silent but at 1:12 it fires up. There is also no high voltage noise from the dc/dc converter so no battery pack. It could also have coasting system or cylinder deactivation..

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Honken, very interesting about the sound. I can't tell. I figured the hybrid/electric stuff would come with the model after the F12M. Maybe its coming sooner?

Milanno, what you say is entirely reasonable but, I agree with Tim that for the money it would be nice to have some differentiation. I suspect Ferrari will continue with shared parts but they will also figure out how to differentiate enough things to keep us interested.

 

IMO the digital binnacle in the LaF is the most unappealing part of the otherwise awesome car. I would bet the same unit will not be used. Also dislike the render with the passenger gadgets. With an easy 800HP (capable of a lot more) the passenger's job is to enjoy the sound and the ride. Agree anything remotely like the Lusso interior is a no go.

 

Strange thing is the engine fired up when at a standing still, not when starting to pull away like a HELO system...

Thoughts?

 

I think you're right Tim. My wild guess is the turbo V8s are a stop gap until they can go to some kind of hybrid system. It might be different from that in the LF but the concept of filling in torque gaps with electric motor power will be similar. However, I am guessing it would be with a smaller displacement NA motor they can tune for higher RPM power and use the electric to replace the missed lower torque and help with emissions. The NA motor will give you sound throughout the rev range. Where should this debut? My guess is the 488 successor, which will be a revolutionary change if the pattern holds (348/355 -> 360/430 -> 458/488 -> ???) I will further speculate (for fun) there won't be much, if any, weight penalty for this system since they won't need the forced induction system and all of the accessories it requires.

I would also have a hard time imagining this sort of thing fitted to the F12M due to the fact that the F12M wouldn't be losing much weight anywhere to off set this likely added weight. And it seems the F12M V12 engine is a development of the current engine.

By my logic (and I know Ferrari and straight A-B logic don't always go!) I would guess the F12M successor will have either an all new smaller V12 + electric or seriously reworked version of this motor that likely does not grow in displacement, but gets smaller....

Anyway, thanks for letting me indulge in some speculation.

I also wish to reply to Solid State about the passenger display. I respect your opinion, but I can speak for at least my case, my wife would not enjoy my constantly deploying all the power and there are times when we are motoring along at a reasonable clip where she would like to see the name of the song or the nav. The current F12b layout doesn't allow for this. I always thought the original passenger display from the FF was a bit crazy because I already hear "we're going pretty fast!", and now they want to make it easier to confirm it?! But, I'm all for a display that allows my passenger to take a glance at the route or stereo info. As a matter of fact, its nice to delegate music/ nav to a passenger- whether its wife or friend.

 

I have a real dilemma if passenger read out (including speed) an option on F12M.Essential for grandson but out of the question for wife !

 

Going slightly off topic, but do people think ferrari will go to a carbon tub and largely carbon body panels to reduce weight on the 488 successor?

 

I agree that a electrified hybrid is not likley to be the case for the F12M. I think I understand why the engine starts at the gate for the f12. He turns the engine off just before he stops and restarts it again. Probably because the was an trouble code or something else that needed a restart of the system as its a dev car. I think the front fenders will have fender grills and a air bridge where the C-pillar is.

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Ferrari made a huge investment in aluminum construction. I'm not so sure when/ if they consider it fully amortized. It seems to me- and this is purely based on stats/ articles/ discussions with friends and some engineers at various automakers over the years- the CF tub advantages are strength (much better for open versions), weight for given strength (average weight savings I can find between cars like the McLaren's and 458/488 is something like 250lbs), and safety (especially very high speed impacts). But disadvantages are expense and increase in production time. Given that modern Ferraris are very safe, and given the market is not having an issue with the rigidity in the 488 Spider the only issue I can see is the weight savings. And there is comes down to an analysis of $/ unit of weight saved.

Any company will look at the costs and benefits to make a decision, but now Ferrari has to show ever increasing profits quarter to quarter. Making a decision to go CF construction any time soon would probably put a solid dent into the bottom line- and that does not seem to be in Mr. Marchionne's play book. Right now especially they need that stock to stay as high as possible.

My guess is they go one more full generation after the 488 successor (~10 years from the new car) before concluding they need the lighter weight and greater safety benefits that CF can give them- and lets face it, its really partial CF as the front and rear sections will still be metal. By then all the shares of RACE that can float on the markets will be out there. Right now its just 10%. FCA has stated it plans to sell more shares of RACE on the open market at some point- I don't remember when- but clearly its to keep raising capital for FCA so they can finance future expansion as Mr. Marchionne has stated they need even more scale.

 

@Chalstrad - I put my deposit on the "F12m" with my ferrari dealer about 4 months ago. while Ferrari may not take deposits, as the dealer said "my pappi told me when someone offers you money, you take it". Basically I am trying to get as far up the allocation for my dealer as possible; they will give the first couple to their multi-repeat purchasers, then hopefully I snuck in. The dealer contacted me to say the factory is now briefing them and they expect it "soon" ... altho in ferrari speak that could mean "before the universe implodes"

 

Don't think I would ever say this for a V12 for Ferrari, but any positive impact on CO2 emissions will have major benefits on the car's pricing in Euro.
Savings on a partial hybrid system for the F12M could easy go as high as $100,000 per car due to tax cuts!

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/ferrari-f12m-look-214117063.html

 

Excellent find Nelsonc275 and kudos to Milanno!

Maximus1973, you make a great point but I speculate the hybrid stuff is for the next generation.

 

I hope that's not close to what it will look like.

 

Just in keeping with the recent M versions it would seem the styling could be a mild change from current look at 550 vs575.. 430 vs 360 ,… california vs california T… FF vs GTC…..458 vs 488…. all relatively similar designs … just mild updates….
Why do we think the F12M would not follow this trend...

 

Maybe the answer lies in the fact they nudged the GTC4 more in the direction of GT and apparently have stated they intend the F12M to go in an even more sporting direction than the F12berlinetta...

 

I agree with you Larryh, it seems as a logical assumption inline with the most recent changes seen on California T, 488 and now the gtc4lusso.

However it's important to note that if you start looking beyond the overall shape and layout, the new cars are very much defferent. Almost every panel is new. The details in general are executed in an updated fashion.

So yes I agree, but then again you can argue it's going to be a new car.