Countach Downdraft 1985 to 1988.5 | Page 188 | FerrariChat

Countach Downdraft 1985 to 1988.5

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by joe sackey, Oct 25, 2015.

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  1. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Nils, really, you ought to relax with this "they are all the same" thing you seem so quick to want to interpret everything as with your "prove me wrong" remarks convey :)

    This is the Downdraft thread, so, Downdrafts are going to be appreciated here. As stated over & over, this thread does not exist to the detriment of other variants. If anyone doesn't like reading about the enthusiasm some have for this variant, I have a solution for them: don't come on this thread.

    As far as I can see, the main claim that has been made in this thread is one which is common-knowledge that existed long before this thread ever materialized, which is: the Downdraft is the most powerful production variant of the Countach. That's a FACT.

    Prove it wrong.
     
  2. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Thank you as always Emilio, perfect.
     
  3. Chaos

    Chaos Formula 3

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    Nick.
    I find it somewhat ironic that Lamborghini homologated the DD, and yet Porsches 959 so often espoused as a Group B car was in fact never homologated by Porsche.

    Interestingly the Countach is one of 11 cars homologated after the main Group B ban, a list that includes several versions of 964 shape 911, Jaguar XJS and even the mighty F40 LM.
    Most of the 11 were later shifted into the relevant FIA GT categories, do we know if the DD was too ?
     
  4. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4679 joe sackey, Nov 8, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Nick,

    I don't know but am trying to discover this.

    The Downdraft was Homologated very late in the series existence.

    Obviously, I know that internally Lamborghini had plans for a competition version based of the Countach Evoluzione but all that never materialized and indeed, its kind of ironic that it ever happened, surprising also.

    IMO, the parallel car is the 288 GTO, FIA Homologated, but it also never entered in competition. That said, the fact that the works made the effort to Homologate it speaks to intent, and this has found favor in the hearts & minds of those that covert the GTO. I believe this will be the case with the Downdraft also.

    BTW the only Countach Downdraft I am aware of that entered FIA GT competition was the privateer Art Sports 25th Anniversario that met with mixed success.
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  5. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4680 joe sackey, Nov 8, 2016
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  6. Chaos

    Chaos Formula 3

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    Nick.
    you have mail
     
  7. Chaos

    Chaos Formula 3

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    Nick.
    basically this is afaik a DD car converted to Individual Throttle Bodies.
    ITB's are great - the idea is that they have the benefits of a carb style airflow (ie no bottlenecks) but with the carefully metered fuel of an injection system.

    they also due to the design and airflow give a very very similar noise to a multi carb setup :) unlike the more muted noise normal fuel injection tends to give.

    modern aftermarket ITB systems can be superb.
    the ecu's are hugely powerful and utilise proper 3D maps
    gains of well over 10% on otherwise standard engines are the norm

    the key is good mapping.

    I would not be surprised to see this QV ITB make close to 500bhp without much more done except finding the right person to map it

    most RR's will give you 2 sets of figures.
    at the wheels - which is an accurate reading, though can be upset by tyre pressures etc
    and
    at the flywheel - which uses coastdown to "best guess", and is wildly innacurate.

    if you want to be more general then the industry accepted rule of thumb figure on a rwd is circa 17% transmission loss - assuming good condition etc.
    so basically if you take your "at the wheels" figure as roughly 83% of the flywheel figure you will likely be in the right ballpark.

    those figures in the picture btw will likely be "flywheel" ones attained by coastdown.

    so anyways this means an average 455bhp DD should be 378bhp at the wheels assuming its healthy (and that they truly had 455bhp - which i do believe)
     
  8. MM355

    MM355 Formula 3

    Apr 7, 2008
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    It is possible, my friend who studied in Switzerland back in the time has owned 4 Countach's from 85-89 whom he daily drove to University.

    He is from KSA and last car he owned was a Black LP500QV with white interior.
     
  9. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Wow, I know a Nero/Bianco Downdraft that is now in the UK (HLA12091), that belonged to a KSA gentleman who was living in Switzerland. What are the chances?
     
  10. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Awesome resource provided mate, thanks!
     
  11. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Nick, since you have responded to him, please note when Roy says "Standard Carb 449-455HP average" he is incorrect. As you can see on the very first page of this thread, I personally contacted the period factory Chief Engineer Luigi Marmiroli who oversaw the production of the Downdraft engine, interviewed him, and received much technical data from him. He clarified, the power output range is 455 to 470 bhp.
     
  12. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4687 joe sackey, Nov 9, 2016
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  13. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4688 joe sackey, Nov 9, 2016
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  14. slownrusty

    slownrusty Formula Junior

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    Oh my gosh...that is an amazing get together. I wonder how many actually reside in Japan?
     
  15. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4690 joe sackey, Nov 9, 2016
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    Verde Abete (?) dark metallic green Downdraft in Japan.

    It appears to have an olive green leather interior.

    Not sure if this is the car's original livery.
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  16. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4691 joe sackey, Nov 9, 2016
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  17. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    More than you can shake a stick at!
     
  18. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #4693 joe sackey, Nov 9, 2016
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  19. roytoy2003

    roytoy2003 F1 Veteran

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    I dis-agree with you..multiple places state the rating I have stated. They are (all Countachs) great cars. However we cant go around saying so and so and so and so "Told me...".

    I would never advertise a car for sale based on those loose hand me down words...you would have a CPA LAWSUIT on you so fast your head would spin.

    You have to use the documented findings by many many outlets and publications. If not, you need to have documentation of your claims with your OWN DYNO testing, at least two separate ones on different machines and condition's of temperature. This would work to a specific car.

    While I have no second thoughts that there are engines that can and do reach what was told to you by an ex factory worker. This information is not and has not been considered correct for ALL DD cars. If it were it would have been published by the factory to the betterment of the Brand. We must be safe and correct to go with the published HP ratings, not the "he said she said"... pass me down numbers.

    This kind of "Legend speaking" does NO brand any good. Lets stick to the documentation of the multiple test cars...and if you have a DYNO for a specific car..GREAT post it in regards to that SPECIFIC car, not the whole lot of them.

    This is IMO. I of course would never provide "un-documented" claims to a vehicle that are not in writing and substantiated. It is just not good for the buyer or the Brand IMO.


    Lamborghini Countach LP 5000 QV 455 hp - Specs & Performance
     
  20. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    This is your source?

    As opposed to the data sheets and DGMs provided directly from the engineer in charge of the engine himself?

    What a joke :rolleyes:

    As I've said, 10 years on FChat and nothing to show as regards any meaningful, useful, verifiable material that benefits the community.

    Why come on here 4-5 times a day, yet, when you have anything to say its the role of the Doubting Thomas based on nothing at all but sour grapes?

    Sounds like the same hypocritical behavior of someone who proclaimed no 25th is worth over $150k and constantly disparaged that car also, but then goes out and buys a boatload of them it turns out he can't sell. Poetic justice no?

    What independent documented claims have YOU ever provided to the benefit of the community?

    Do yourself a favor, go for a drive, sell a Countach, do something, because you know what response you'll get from me when you respond to one of my posts with your mouthy long-winded BS.

    If you want to do anything that's on-topic here, why not post that black Downdraft you claim you have? :)

    FYI, I'm 100% confident about any so-called claims or representations I have made here.
     
  21. Spyder-Man

    Spyder-Man Formula 3

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    Bloody hell!!!!
     
  22. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    That's what I thought!

    By the way, that picture was sent to me by a kind gentleman in the UK this very morning - he deserves all the credit.
     
  23. SupercarGuru

    SupercarGuru F1 Rookie
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    #4698 SupercarGuru, Nov 9, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    We recently hosted the first ever "Collectors Weekend" at the famous Bal Harbour Shops in Miami. Some of the greatest watch and car collectors brought out their "Sunday's Best," for display including Jim Glickenhaus. Glickenhaus journeyed South to show both Ferrari P4/5 by Pininfarina and SCG 003!

    Besides P4/5 and SCG 003... our Countach Downdraft got the most incredible attention amongst an original Daytona Spider, Pagani Huarya, LaFerrari, 918 Spyder and much more!!

    And yes, thats rocker Tommy Lee admiring the icon!
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  24. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    That is FANTASTIC John!

    That is what this thread is all about, positive energy, generated & shared by enthusiasts.
     
  25. roytoy2003

    roytoy2003 F1 Veteran

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    As I stated, this is IMO. I see however you take it as a personnel attack, which you should not..once your car is complete I am sure, as well as hope, you post the results of its 2 tested dynos results.. I hope it gets 500HP that would be great. As I said, I am sure there are many that can and do make more then the Public Posted HP for records..

    My DD?? I have no idea its HP, as I just enjoy driving it as I do all my cars..BUT when and if I sell it..I surely WILL not advertise a HP that is not documented...

    so when you get yours documented, if thats what you want to do, post it for us all. I wish you all the 470 HP well wishes in the world..
     

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