Header Questions & Recommendations

How can you quantify that most of the power was due to the tune? Fabspeed suggests that power is the ~40trq ~20hp. Did you dyno it? Did you have incremental upgrades or was it all at one go?
I'm looking at some headers for preventative measures. It would be beneficial if we had some data which manufacturer yields the most power per $

 

Yup, I have the dyno charts which I will post. The claims are very ambitious, I wish they were true. Fabspeed numbers aren't even close to reality but there are ways to trick a dyno. This was done a dynojet load bearing dyno so somewhat conservative but shows the actual gains.

 

Check out OE Tunings website, there is some info on the f430 tune. My numbers are better than that but I attribute the difference to the headers where their car was stock.

 

Naturally companies would inflate performance numbers for sales purposes.
OE website suggests 25hp and 10trq. Is that inline to what your butt dyno tells you?

 

Yes, but we got a bit more I think mainly because of the headers. I'll post up the results tomorrow. BTW, almost no torque. They did say the program will learn and just as the car is driven and it will improve but that remains to be seen. I believe most people think they have more performance because it sounds ridiculous. . I can tell you it wants to break loose very easily in second gear and I have 325's on the rear.

 

i went with capristo hiflow cats in one of my 430s. im having capristo headers put in as we speak and i left the exhaust oem. will see how it sounds and then maybe go with a capristio to finish it off

 

To give you guys some real numbers, I'm attaching a dyno graph to shed some light.

This particular F430 had the Fabspeed/Agency Power headers with the S-line exhaust, no cats, 93 octane. We did not have the car to do the baseline before the header/exhaust install, we only did the ECU calibration. You can see the huge gains on the top end. This car made over 30+ whp from our flash.

It's hard to say how much power the headers do add, and I think the ecu re-cal helps extract more, the factory cal's run extremely conservative from the factory. Its hard to speculate, we've done several different 430's with different combinations but none have been tested doing individual mods, only ECU flash.

I bought a F430 a couple months ago, and I'm going to do some testing on my dyno with combinations between stock vs. our ecu flash vs. ecu flash and aftermarket headers vs. stock tune with aftermarket headers. I have yet to purchase headers yet, but soon. I will share the results. It will be then we can definitively conclude exactly what each mod will gain with each combination.
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Better sound, better response and the engine temps are fine. Actually I think it runs cooler. No Dyno run yet but I know it made some power gains

 

That's awesome. Looking forward to reading what you learn about the platform now that you own one as well.

 

A friend of mine has this setup with the Capristo race exhaust and it sounds great, actually shoots flames.

 

I have the exact same experience but didn't see much torque gained. I believe the headers will get you less than 10hp to the wheels.

 

Looking forward to your experience with headers and stock muff. That's what I'm looking at doing also.

 

Fantastic dyno numbers. Glad to see there's some power on the table to be had.

 

I was going to start another thread but may as well keep all the relevant info in one place. Attached is one of the dyno runs we did. Base vs headers, exhaust and tune (OE Tuning).

On one run the HP jumped 42hp but torque was down. I don't know if others are using more optimistic dyno's or what the differences might be.
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I am going to go back and run again and see if the ECU has made any adjustments. I doubt that it will be anything significant.

 

Is the blue line on your graph baseline, and the red line with the mods and tune? Looks like the headers actually lose significant power and torque from 4K - 5250 RPM. Surprising and given I have the same setup as you..disappointing. I did notice the tube diameter of both the headers and S-line exhaust is larger then stock, so now I wonder if there is actually a power loss without doing a tune. Maybe these small displacement, high reving flat plane crank engines do better with the smaller diameter tubing.

Also if given that dip in power and TQ is due to the poor Fabspeed header design, looks like the Capristo headers are definitely worth the additional cost.

 

My experience with bolts-ons in general is they give up a little for some additional power somewhere else. The manufacturers claims are all full of **** for the most part. The tune is supposed to make the most of the upgrades. Quite frankly I was expecting more considering what I spent to have all of this done. I do love the sound and I am making a bit more power. The true test is to race another stock 430. The dyno is not an exact measuring tool and there are variables. Also this dyno is load bearing so there is resistance and the numbers won't represent as high as a on load bearing dyno. With this said the car does want to break loose all the way through third gear so who knows exactly what I am making now.

 

Interesting results Gh. I'm shocked at the power dip after 4K. That's where the legs start moving!
I'd like to see if the tune actually addresses this. Thanks for sharing!

 

You can't feel the dip at all and I am actually thinking about going back to have it dynoed again to see if the ECU has made any adjustments. There is a thread started by Andrie who shows a much bigger dip in the same area.

 

Feel it or not, it's there and significant. Just like you mentioned, this confirms Andrie's result. No brainer spending the extra money for Capristo headers. Wish I saw this result before my header purchase.

 

Not sure if it is related to Fabspeed or not, Mase' plot doesn't show any dip. I aim to find out though.

 

Yup, no brainer alright. Tri y (4-2-1) headers suit street cars better than 4-1. Ferrari decided this also for these models. Also a primary pipe diameter increase is only required if other engine mods are done. Like cams, compression etc. You only need a bigger exhaust if the engine can suck more in and make a bigger bang. The advantages from these aftermarket headers is no pre-cat (which is the small bump in performance) and a more robust header that wont crack.

 

sorry for the stupid question... what is meant be the y ? 4-2-1 design vs others like fabspeed? any photos showing the difference?

 

4-2-1 meaning 4 pipes got to 2 then consolidate to 1 vs. 4 pipes consolidating to 1. Quite frankly it has been proven there isn't one better than the other, give and take from either design.

 

I'm not so sure this is the case, seems more opinion than fact. I would love to see a dyno from someone other than the mnfr. to compare.