Poll: Winter storage to start or not to start

this is best …. just keep fuel stabilizers and chargers… if you can temp consistent like a hvac garage then nothing to worry about...

 

Where do I collect

 

Same here...I think they see salt in their dreams.

 

excellent post...and I agree.

 

Park your car on 4 sandbags. No more flat spotting.

If you want to get fancy, get 4 of these. https://raceramps.com/car-ramps/car-storage-ramps/flatstoppers/

 

YES

 

Bearing in mind I live in the NE and roads are salted for 5 months or so, driving in winter not practicable. 23 years have followed this regime. Clean car throughly, Add fuel stabilizer at last fill up before hibernation. Change oil and run once on road fairly vigorously to bring evrything up to temperature. Park in garage, disconnect battery, fill tires to 50 psi, cover car. Every few weeks or so roll the car a bit from where its resting to avoid flat spots.

In spring simply connect the battery check oil lower tires psi to correct level and youre good to go.

Starting in winter is a no no. In relaity youre not getting any idling engine up to real temperature just sitting, your capturing moisture doing numerous cols starts and basicaly doing he car no good.

If started a ferrari should be run well for more than a few miles..

 

Agreed with this and several of the similar posts. The problem with starting the engine occasionally and letting it idle for 10 minutes is that it doesn't get to operating temperature - you end up creating condensation in the engine and exhaust and fuel dilution of the oil, both dilute the oil and create acidity. For 4 or 5 months, it really is better to leave the engine sit than to start and idle for 10 minutes occasionally.

The exception would be if you could run it long enough to get the engine oil up to full operating temperature - but with salt on the road for many of us, that's worse than leaving it unstarted.

One mention that Rifledriver has commented on in the past - if I recall correctly, and apologies in advance if I am incorrect, he has seen 308 gearboxes destroyed by internal corrosion from lack of use. I suspect it would take several years of non-use, not just a winter, but turning over the transmission and differential to re-coat the gear surfaces with transmission oil would have a definite benefit. This wouldn't even require starting the engine...

To avoid acid buildup, condensation, and fuel dilution from short idling periods without warming up the engine, but to circulate oil in the engine and transmission - we could actually support the rear of the frame on jack stands to get the rear wheels off the ground, pull the fuel pump fuse, and run the starter with the engine in 1st gear to turn the engine over, rotate the transmission internals, build oil pressure, without incurring combustion byproducts and fuel dilution that wouldn't burn off with a short idling session. To avoid overheating the starter, perhaps use a 5 second cranking interval, repeated a few times, would be sufficient to circulate the oil. That would achieve the stated objective of keeping the internals coated in oil, avoid seals drying out, etc.

 

Parking on really thick, plush carpet works too.

Since my Wife said I couldn't park my cars in the living room, (Jeeze!) I got a few long, 15" wide strips of carpet free from my local carpet guy, made sure they were high quality, thick, expensive, carpet.

I park my Ferrari and my Jag on the strips and even after sitting for a couple of months, no flat spotting.

I would not have believed this could work, especially since my Jag was prone to flat spots after just a few days sitting in the garage. The suspension of that car sends any vibration to the driver immediately. But when it worked for the Jag, I tried it on the Ferrari and am very happy with the results.

Economical (free!) and easy to replace if it gets crushed down too much or soiled.
Alden

 

People also mentioned drying out of seals. Since my last eo 6 years ago, which was done well, I see no oil leaks. Hoses will rot from outside due to ozone apprently. From my experience water hoses rot internally over time, and those hoses are internally wet.

Yes driving every week and bringing everything fully up to temp is best, but realisticaly in many cases thats not possible.

Fresh oil before storage keeps acid buildup off bearings, my concerns always are rust in cylinder bores which will accelerate ring wear.

I remember taking an exhaust manifold off a boat for 1 month and the amount of surface rust I saw on the exhaust port when i returned to install the new one. This was a freshwater boat.

Winter in the NE tends to be very dry once temps go below freezing.

I am guessing that the newer cars have liner coatings for which rust is nearly a non issue.

In the end though, if you warmed your ferrari for 5 -10 mins every day, drove slowly working up temp and and 30-100 vigorous miles per day, every day your motor would last longest.

therefore its really a question of what sort of downtime does the least damage.

BTW make sure to bleed brakes every two years and change gearbox oil and coolant at same interval.

Another option is storing in bag full of dessicant, to drive moisture below 50%, when i live abroad I did this in addition to the rest of my regime, my car sat for up to 13 months, and all it ever needed was a fresh battery connected to start and run fine for the few weeks i was in town.

 

.......why I am planning a pre-luber install.
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.......why I am planning a pre-luber install.

 

Seems like a lot of trouble and expense. Dinner and a movie works great for me.
Alden

 

Pull the plugs and spray each cylinder with fogging oil.

 

I drive mine in the winter. Then again it was 80f today.

 

Or just fog the engine while it's running so everything gets coated.

 

Synthetic oil will no longer cling to cylinder walls after 3 days and 7 days for dino oils. This has been discussed at length at BITOG, so whenever you start your car after a period of just a week or two idle, you are doing a dry start.

Starting it with the intent of driving it is really the best way to go through the winter months. But, if you are truly locked in for long term winter storage, I would rather run everything up regularly to temp once a week or just store it with fresh fluids and not touch the ignition key until it's time to drive again.

You aren't going to foul your plugs unless you are using several stages cooler in heat range typically found on modified engines and a race style plug. Today's iridium and copper plugs of the right heat range to ensure a smooth idle will generate enough cleaning action on the tip and electrode idling and brought up to temperature.

There's also nothing like the smell of a warm classic car, leather, metal, rubber, and gasoline creating the best garage air freshener money can buy.

P.S. Those who say don't start them hasn't dealt with a 512BBi who's flat 12 half sits in oil and gas and what happens with those bores. You actually want to run them up regularly, or so I hear.

 

There's a lot of talk here about cars being started up in winter and left idling to warm up to full temperature if they're not being driven.

The advice I was given was not to let the car just idle, but to sit in the car and replicate driving revs, so start off by gently revving the engine from idle to @ 2000rpm, then going up to @ 2500~3000rpm, then going up to @4000 rpm as the car warms up, and once the engine oil was up to full operating temperature, going up to @ 5000rpm.

By using that method, I struggle to see how you'd induce any additional moisture into the engine than by driving it, and any extra fuel from the cold start will be dealt with, just the same as it would be by driving it.

Saying all that, this whole topic will boil down to doing what you feel most comfortable with!

Those who don't see the need to start the car up in winter will continue not to, and those that feel it is better for the car to start it up will continue to start their cars up.

 

Revving an engine without load has its problems too, regarding vibrations and such.

My view: park it in autumn when fully hot - oil, brakes and exhaust, and park it immediate after driving, without shutdowns in between. Then unhook the battery, put it on blocks so the tires are free (or on soft pads to avoid flat spotting) and leave it alone until the spring.
If you start it in between, rinse and repeat.

 

be aware of the condensation that develops in the exhaust system when the car is started... this condensation is corrosive if left in the exhaust system... it is best to heat the exhaust system to where all the condensation is dispersed... depending on temperature is may take quite a while to disperse... especially at idle speeds... there is no correct answer on starting the car as each start affects different areas... my preference would be to not to start the car unless it can be driven where everything can go through a full heat cycle where everything gets its' share of conditioning

 

Same, but I don't have a heated garage, so if it's REALLY cold, I don't start the car.

 

I have a friend who is a fleet mechanic. He has a 20 ft every 20 day rule. If trucks are sitting he moves them 20 feet so all the bearings and seals that can get oil and grease do.

 

Based on the temperatures generated with the method of warming the car up that I was advised to use, there's absolutely no way there's going to be any more risk of condensation in the exhaust than if the car had been driven on a 348!

(Last winter I was having to strip off to a T-shirt in the garage as it got so hot in there by the time the engine was fully warmed up, and I had to be careful not to burn My arm on the exhaust system when I reconnected the battery tender!)

 

this discussion needs to be framed better i think. it makes a difference if we are talking about cars that are driven as daily drivers in the good weather vs cars that sit even during the nice months. For daily drivers id say start them up and drive them in the winter. for garage queens i say dont start them and dont drive them. in the end you will have no idea if you "won" because all cars need service when you want to drive them. The dollars spent will average out over time and you will have probably killed more brain cells than anything else.

 

I think it is safe to say there are many recommendations as to what you should do.

Personally I think the best option is if you need to start it then take it out for a proper drive.
About 45 minutes in the North West of the UK so it gets used properly.
In essence its best to use them.

That is what I will do with the Alfa Spider. My 360 is under cover in the partially heated garage attached to house. That will as mentioned stay off unless I need to move it.