Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918 | Page 807 | FerrariChat

Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari/F80' started by mpowered, Nov 3, 2012.

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  1. lafars

    lafars Karting

    Jul 6, 2016
    106
    apart from the fact that the weissach doesn't have a racecar-interior, racecar-seats, a huge splitter, winglets, racecar-steeringwheel and a static wing
     
  2. Westview

    Westview Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2014
    295
    Well there we have it. Lieven/Mycroft is tacitly admitting that stock 918 is quicker than the stock P1, and that the only way it can compete is through a tuner company, not even McLaren itself. Wow. Stunning.

    In an earlier post, he said that the reason it had narrow tires was that it was designed as a road car, and the narrower tires were meant to help against tramlining.

    This is totally at odds with what Ron Dennis said when the car was introduced: it would be the fastest road car on any track. To me the car is the most track purposed of any of the three hypercars with a race mode, big wing, etc. Yet they decided to put on narrow tires to avoid tramlining on the road? LOL.

    I have more faith in the P1 than Lieven does: if I could buy a hypercar, and the main purpose of the purchase was to track the car, I would still get the P1 over the other two. It looks like a hoot to drive on the track.
     
  3. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Err, not that I know of. They both use the same size tyres, but the P1 GTR use slicks and the LM uses Cup 2s.
     
  4. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Noise limits on an F1 circuit?

    Usually the factory test driver is the best option. If you look at Dodge and Chevrolet factory laps, they're usually a few seconds better than the likes of Randy Pobst or C&D drivers can manage.

    He past 2 cars on the whole lap, cost less than a second.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wplfrYpox0&t=78s

    Evidence of worn tyres? The One:1 hasn't really proven itself to be amazingly fast anywhere.

    It's the closest to a 918 in tyre size and type yes. Probably doesn't have straps for door handles though.
     
  5. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    You add completely inconsequential things to try make a case. What difference does the racing steering wheel make exactly? Static wing? Surely there are many other cars with a static wing. Does the wing on a GT3 or GT3 RS move? Splitters and winglets are hardly new to road cars either.

    It's amazing the pathetic excuses you can suddenly find but never notice anything when the 918 competes with 20mm wider tyres at either end, which are far stickier Cup 2s and a HL mode that only lasts 2 minutes. The weight difference of the LM would be inconsequential in this equation, it's the wider, stickier tyres and the added aero that would make the difference. Truth is Porsche is just scared to go up against a car on fully equal tyres.
     
  6. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Standard P1 has what are very narrow tyres designed to make road driving better. Meanwhile the LaF and 918 have gigantic tyres for track performance. I thought it would be interesting to see what happens when the cars are running on equal width and equal type tyres.

    Why else would you put tyres that narrow on? Seriously, I'm all ears. Why? Why give a car with 900+hp that weighs 1500kg the same size tyres as a 991 GT3, if not for road manners? Do you think the McLaren F1's suspension was set up for track driving too?
     
  7. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 13, 2015
    5,908
    Scottsdale/Pittsburgh
    Full Name:
    Jon


    Why Koenigsegg Couldn't Set The Record They Deserved To Set

    Noise limits are fairly common for open track days at circuits. Not on Forza or Need for Speed though, so I wouldn't expect you to be familiar ;)
     
  8. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    OMG the excuses. There are tracks without noise limits. And why doesn't Koenigsegg just do a car the same as the production version? These excuses should not exist. To put things in perspective, a P1 was only 4s slower than a P1 GTR on Bahrain International (same day, pro drivers in both), and a P1 GTR carrying a passenger ran 2:20 on Spa (oh and 2:04 on Thermal Long with a passenger and a customer driving for all the Salomondrin subscribers).

    So far all Koenigsegg has done is set some distinctly mediocre times, marginally beaten a 550ps GT-R at Suzuka, made excuses and crashed at the Nurburgring.
     
  9. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    Ah, so i see you shoot yourself, AGAIN.

    So UTQG means something now? The lower it is the stickier it is? Then you completely shattered your own argument that the Cup2 is stickier than Trofeo R.

    After all, the Trofeo R is rated at UTQG 60 vs UTQG 180 for the Cup2s.

    Using your own logic, then the Trofeo R has to be a lot softer and stickier.
     
  10. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    Nonsense excuse. Go ask any 918 owners or LaFerrari owners do their car tramline?

    They have wider tires simply because the chassis was designed with the HP rating in mind, that's why they have wider tires to cope with the massive power.

    So now you are implying McLaren designed the P1 to fishtail instead of 'tramline'?
     
  11. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    Not when he says the Cup2s are stickier than Cup2s. Perfectly logical.
     
  12. Westview

    Westview Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2014
    295
    Only McLaren could know for sure. I suspect the reason is that the base chassis, the mp4, couldn't handle wider tires without a major rework. I believe the P1 tires are already wider than the MP4, and that this was as wide as the base chassis could fit.

    Don't forget that when the car was being designed, they had no sales yet, and must have been rightfully nervous about over spending on the car's development and then trying to sell 375 $1million units. What if it was like the Lexus LFA , a commercial flop? Fortunately it was extremely successful and the generated substantial profits. So then they did rework the car to fit wider tires on the GTR model.
     
  13. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Not always no, the point was simply to illustrate that the ACR's tyres have two very different layers, yet the official UTQG rating is 200 for Kumho V720 ACRs, just as it is for Cup 2s. Both different version of Cup 2 on the AMG GTR are 200 also.

    The Corsa also has the same rating as the Trofeo R.:)

    I rest my case.
     
  14. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Like it or not, that's the only logical reason. It's not like they put narrower tyres on just to save a few quid now is it? Why does the P1 LM and track-only P1 GTR have wider tyres?
     
  15. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Proven case, AMG GTR. Sport Auto even confirmed it.
     
  16. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    And you don't think the P1 is a seriously major rework anyway, and they were already going to do the GTR, so why not just use that as a basis?

    Even the LFA sold out. When building only 500 or less, it's really not a concern.

    If Porsche could manage to increase tyre width by 20mm for the GT3 RS vs GT3, then I'm sure the costs wouldn't be that massive, especially since McLaren went and did them anyway, for even lower volume cars. Your argument makes zero sense.

    Jeez, I've seen people modify a MkII Escort to fit wider tyres, and I'm sure it didn't cost that much.
     
  17. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 13, 2015
    5,908
    Scottsdale/Pittsburgh
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Lieven, Myrocraft...the person who makes excuse after excuse for Macca but also will call any other brand out for making "excuses". Textbook hypocrite.
     
  18. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    So now the answer is not always. Hmm.

    Make up mind dude, you have been flip flopping whenever the facts gets in the way of your fantasy.

    You do realized how comical you made yourself looked like in forums right?
     
  19. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    Cause AMG made no secret about it. It's an officially sanctioned tire.

    It doesn't mean that compound is going into any other tires.
     
  20. Whoopsy

    Whoopsy Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2012
    834
    Vancouver, BC

    And please check with your boss on how much work they did to fit those wider tires.

    AP made no secret on how much they had to do to fit wider tires on the GT3RS which the chassis wasn't designed for.
     
  21. kandi

    kandi Formula 3

    Jun 27, 2014
    1,677
    So I'm glad he is a credible source, because I simply quoted what he had answered under his videos from Silverstone laps.
     
  22. lafars

    lafars Karting

    Jul 6, 2016
    106
    *facepalm

    the weissach package is far from a racecar for the road and the LM is a P1 GTR+ with all unecessary weight thrown out and probably straight cut gearbox

    comparing the P1 LM to the 918 WP is like comparing the the 458 speciale to the 458 challenge racecar, one is a trackday car, the other is full on track car
     
  23. Westview

    Westview Formula Junior

    Nov 2, 2014
    295
    Forget the P1 LM. It is a unicorn. Do you know anyone who has heard of anyone who has one? Neither do I. This is another diversion by Mycroft when the topic is about the three original hypercars, not some modified one off.
     
  24. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    The answer is complicated, the answer is that the official UTQG doesn't even necessarily represent the true UTQG. But on the MkV ACR, we know it didn't drop 5.3s from chassis, aero and engine mods alone.
     
  25. Lieven

    Lieven Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    885
    Not that specific compound, but we can logically assume many other bespoke Cup 2s have similar levels of grip.
     

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