Ferrari 488 Compared to the McLaren 720s

I have a 488gts on order...looks like i will delay my order from july build into sept for a 2018.

I have a 650s. It is a better car than the 488 i have driven for 500 miles.

I will probably flip out of my 488 if there is no improvement.

 

I should add that @ the geneva show the excitement and crowds at the mclaren stand were equal at minimum to ferrari.

Mclaren is well on its way.....

 

This is true. They aren't so focused on protecting their early customer base. They release improvements much quicker than other brands. It's a boon and a curse. Boon because Mclaren are out performing most other exotics with their quick updates. Curse for new buyers.

Solution? Buy used. Enjoy!

 

Mclaren built so few cars with a tiny dealer network.
Things are changing.
Ferrari take heed...oops too late They IPO'd

 

Huh? I'll bet you $10K that there will be a 488 Speciale. I'll bet you $100K that there will be Speciale of whatever the next V8 Ferrari is. I'll bet you $500K there will be a higher performance 812.

Who cares if the announce the obvious? You guys act like you're stunned and caught off guard when the track day version of an exotic is announced, even though they've been doing it for like 15 years, consistently now, across every single brand and model...

You'd have to be completely oblivious to the market if you buy a new exotic thinking there won't be a track day version that's better within a few years.

 

Once again noone your blindness for McLaren overlooks the obvious.

By pushing into the market an LT you screw early adopters of the 720s. But that's what McLaren always does --- a new model every year to replace the "old" one.

McLaren loves to push tin into the US market driving down used car prices. They produce too much product, ship it unsold to US dealers who discount it to move it out, and then replace it with a new model the next year.

The only difference here is they are finally admitting their strategy to help themselves but screw over their best customers.

 

720 will be a 5 year life cycle
The LT will be track focused and a different animal.

 

Yah well McLaren's credibility is zero on this issue.

 

I was told by my ferrari dealer. Order a f12. Last normally aapirated ferrari.
Then :
Order a gtc4lusso. Definitely the last normally aspirated car.
Then.......
812?
When will they stick a v8 in the 812? They can call it "prettyfast" to make their #'s?

Its business, let us remember that. Mclaren is now building better cars and they are getting better at the business too.

Time will tell. In the meantime if you want the best car in each category, buy a mclaren.

 

If you are asking me to defend Ferrari's business practices you are asking the wrong person!

The facts are that Ferrari does do a better job to protect its best customers than McLaren does. Early adopters of all Macs always get screwed.

 

I drove a 488 Spider about two weeks before driving the 720S. They're both wonderful cars and obviously if you want a Spider right now (McLaren 720S Spider is 2 years away) then only one of them can do that for you.

 

Agreed..but its no longer early....dealer network and public and press perception are just going straight up.
Ferrari owners are getting screwed now with very good but not great product.

 

Fascinating that the Mac is so dramatically superior that everyone focuses on depreciation, surely the debate is which is the better car ?

Keep building better cars in much lower numbers than Ferrari and the rest will taken are of itself and it won't take 70 years !

 

Amazingly the McLaren are always the best on paper - when they get tested head_to-head they are not; which for the fans is not an issue because when their car is tested the next one is already there to be the best on paper...
In all independent reviews the 650S is behind the 488 GTB; actually one needed the 675LT (at a significantly higher price) to be only marginally better performing than the Ferrari.
But now (before we can get any independent review) we're told that the 720S is far better, and if when actually assessed it will not be that obvious, no issue because the 720LT will already be there to promise everything on paper.

 

No the real question is "what is actually better".

Is 212 MPH better than 208? Is 0-60 2.7 vs 2.9 secs better?

I don't think so. But some obviously do. To me this is a losing game. The next guy comes out with a faster car and suddenly you're no longer the top dog. Hell I bet if Telsa came out with a lightweight CF tub car, juiced up motor with sticky tires they would be in the 1's.

And what sacrifices in style, cost, and "emotion" do you have to lose to get those numbers? You really want an electric car or a hybrid? I don't.

What really and truly is "better"?

We are producing road cars that would qualify at Indy now, compete with AC, leather, GPS, cup holders and fancy stereos.

Do we really need to?

 

They're not pushing anything and they're not screwing over anyone. Someone did an article where the McLaren CEO talked about their brand cadence. Big deal. Ferrari has been doing exactly this for almost 20 years now, Porsche does it way more, and Lamborghini also does it consistently. We all know coupe, spider, LT coupe, LT spider the special edition(s). An LT version of this car is probably 4 years away and will be a different proposition from the more luxury-oriented 720S and likely built in limited numbers. Oh yes we know after 5-6 years they're going to replace this car all together. Is it really blasphemy to treat prospective customers like intelligent beings when they already know the plan?

I think being honest and forward about your product line is beneficial to customers. There are plenty of folks who are happy to wait and pay the higher price for the lighter, more raw, less-ideal-for-the-street, track-focused car. It's a lot better to admit there will be one than to fool them into buying the one they might not want. Likewise there will be a lot more folks for whom that car isn't their thing so admitting the truth doesn't harm the marketplace one bit. It also helps the resale value of the existing 675LTs because the folks who want the more track-focused model know the 720S isn't it so they should either go looking for a used 675LT or wait 4 years and hope they qualify to purchase one.

Do you also think there won't be a new iPhone this year? If you interview Apple's CEO he'll tell you there will be a new one every year.

I urge you to kindly consider that the story you keep telling over and over and over again (like a broken record) is the OLD McLaren Automotive story, not the current one. In the OLD story, yes, they probably sold more 12Cs and 650S, than the market could take of a new car brand with a very small number of dealers, to keep them in business and get to the point where they could have multiple product lines at different prices points. That story started 6 years ago when the 12C went on sale. But in 6 short years they've managed to write a much better story...

Every car McLaren has brought to market since the 12C/650S has done well and has improved driver engagement. P1 sold out, 675LT sold out, 675LT Spider sold out, 570S is doing very well in the market (used prices holding nicely because it's a more affordable car to begin with so there's a larger market) and all of these cars got stellar reviews and so far have held their prices pretty well. A used P1 went for $2.39M (a million dollar premium not including sellers commission) at the Gooding & Co. auction at Amelia Island last weekend. I sold my 675LT for $20K more than I paid with 2,200 miles on the odometer and friends have seen two legitimate offers for their MSO HS models at around $1.2M which is likely double what they paid for them.

Customers are coming around to the brand and they had a record sales year last year thanks to the Sport Series (570S, 570GT). New dealerships were opened last year with more coming this year. Now with 720S they're going to have another car that just blows people away and I'm confident will review spectacularly and is hands-down the best car in its class. They'll have two distinct product lines with a $100,000 price separation, unique selling points, unique features and different personalities.

So please Mayor, stop telling this old story and give them a chance. Also go drive a 720S when you get a chance. You should also drive a 570S so you can feel how wonderful it is. It's time for you to stop telling that same old story.

 

I like the 570s. I said so as soon as it was introduced. Best looking interior around. Vegas will get a new dealer and that will help. And I think at the right price point / value.

 

I agree, its stiff monocell, steering not too light, the crackle and pop of the exhaust and knowing everything is super resolved. Cutting edge design eg side vents.

 

MarkNC....the 675lt was not sold out. I was offered multiple cars including spider. Many times.
I bought a 650s at a huge discount new.
The dealer tells all kinds of lies to get you to buy more i.e. There won't be a variant to the 650s, oh wait, there won't be a spider 675lt, oh wait the p14 is 8 years away....and so on.
I appreciate corp is now public about their strategy and not really different than ferrari except quicker cycles which leads to depreciation. I don't really care.
I found the Mc to be faster but so boring and a step backwards to ferrari sans rigidity of tub.
Hopefully the 720 is a better experience. It looks stunning vs the 488 and even 812stupidname.
But will it have the intangible emotion of a ferrari?

I have a 488 spider incoming and am changing out for the 812 and then to xyz ferrari until I find a keeper. Or, pick up a tdf and call it quits.

 

That's not true the 570S has been winning comparative reviews since it arrived on the scene.

The proper car to compare the 488 to (non-limited production mid-engined supercar) is the 720S and it's here now and ready for reviews which start next month. I've driven both (488 and 720S) and 720S is easily the better car to the 488 in just about every aspect except that you can't get it in spider form. That said, the 488 is still a wonderful car and I really enjoyed driving it. If I had unlimited money I'd get a 488 Spider to go with my 720S coupe.

That's complete nonsense and I've just given you an independent review from a customer standpoint (I own both brands). An LT model is years away.

 

Just because you were offered them doesn't mean they didn't sell out. They made 1,000 cars, they sold all 1,000 cars. P1 also sold out.

12C/650S product cycle was an anomaly caused by immaturity and rushing the 12C to market too early to get the company moving. Going forward their product cycle lengths are pretty much the exact same as Ferrari except time between launches of spiders and coupes appear to be longer for McLaren than Ferrari as 488 was really short compared to 458. But that's likely because the changes weren't drastic.

You really should drive the 720S when you can. I was amazed at how far it's advanced them in terms of driving engagement and excitement. It definitely has a little 675LT blood it in. It's not a replacement for that car but it's far less tame (in the most positive ways) than 650S was while being even more luxurious and having an amazing feature set. They totally nailed it as far as I can tell from driving one for 4 days and about 800 miles & over 18 hours driving time in it. I really think this car (along with 570S/GT) really turn McLaren's sails squarely in the right direction but I've felt the winds turning since the P1 emerged. That car was so good in terms of driver enjoyment that there was no way they were heading anywhere but in the right direction.

I don't share this viewpoint but I understand how people can think the 12C/650S was a little sedate with it's long-pull throttle pedal compared to the hair-trigger pedal of the Ferrari 458. But the 720S is a huge jump from the 650S in terms of driver engagement - in fact a much bigger jump than the 488 is from the 458.

 

Ok, cool. I feel the same way. We bought one and I tried to convince my wife that we would trade that car when the 720S comes in but she refused. I can't blame her. I love driving it. There's just something so right about that car. I describe the road feel and steering as "delicious" because that's the best word I can use to convey how they make you feel. Plus it so much easier to live with (more storage space, easy ingress/egress) than 675LT. 720S feels like they took the 570S and crossed it with a 675LT. It's just the perfect blend. It's far more aggressive than 570S yet more luxurious at the same time. It boggles my mind how they're coming up with such delicious recipes these days. Give it a chance when you can! It's going to change your perspective!

 

It will be hard to get me out of my Alfa 4c at $65K and $220 per year maintenance. Yes, it has its pains and sacrifices but it's got to be the most fun per $$$ on the road today.

But the 570s is really a great car for it's price. It is, IMO, the car they should have made before the 12c. I think they should have gone after the bread and butter 911 than the Ferrari 458.

If I were looking at a daily driver 911, I would certainly be looking at a 570s.

 

Haha are you the mayor? I just arrived in vegas

 

This was temporary (and necessary) to boot up the company and they've come very far after bringing their first product to market only 6 years ago! They're settling into a nice groove now. 570S and 720S will have normal 5-6 year product cycles with predictable variants - coupe, spider, LT coupe, LT spider, and special edition(s) before overhaul. They're also now selling 570S GT4 and 570S Sprint track-only cars with the first few having started deliveries.

They have three distinct road car product lines: sports series (570S/GT) starting at $185K, super series (12C/650S, 675LT, 720S) starting at $285K and ultimate series which so far (P1, BP23) have started at $1M. The ultimate series will be limited production, higher-priced special cars but I suspect not all will be above $1M.