FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX DE MONACO 2017: RACE *** SPOILERS ***

That's because F1 is now seen as an entertainment, when it should be the ultimate motoring competition.

 

Kimi finished second and is upset.

So??????? Isn't any driver who finishes 2nd upset?

 

If he suspects his team to have favoured Vettel at his expense by deliberately manipulating the pit stops , you can see his point.

 

Did they? Hard to tell. For sure they did not ask him to pull over and let Vettel through. They did not tell Kimi to let Vettel take the first corner (I actually thought they would).

Both guys had well prepared cars. Both had 1 tire stop. Neither was told to slow down for the other.

I'm sure Kimi is upset. But it's understandable.

 

You said you wanted to see people racing - whenever I raced, if I didn't pass people, I'd failed. What's your take on racing...... dancing around playing follow my leader? Sorry mate, I don't get it

 

Kimi looks like he has been let down, somehow...

 

Aiming to pass the guy in front of you maybe your goal, so you put all your effort into it; but it doesn't mean that he has to yield for you to feel good.

Racing means attacking, defending, and not only passing.

The notion that passing has to be made easier for the spectacle to be worth watching sounds rather ridiculous to me. That's manipulation in my book.

Do you imagine that applied to any other sports? to athleticism?

If a chap takes the lead in a marathon and creates a gap with his followers, should he be made to slow down to give them a chance? No way !!!

 

Not hard to tell at all! Having Kimi pit so that he comes out right exactly behind the 2 guys that caused he and Vettel to lose tons of time earlier in the race was not only blatant, it felt like they were sticking it to him. That is how it appeared he felt and it had a lot to do with why he slowed down after, IMO. He probably thought about letting Ricciardo through just to stick it right back to the team.
It's too early in the season to screw your own drivers and disorient your fans!

 

+1

I agree with that.

I think some teams decide early on who they are going to push forwards, and the other guy feels it as well.

That doesn't create good atmosphere in the team.

 

Except Kimi asked for a pit stop.

Not too early? In the second race this year Mercedes told Bottas to MOVE OVER for Hamilton. Was that too early?

 

You are talking about something different.

If I remember correctly, Bottas was loosing ground whilst Hamilton was gaining on him. Correct me if I am wrong.

Asking him not to delay the inevitable and facilitate his team mate through is understandable in these conditions.

At Monaco today, there was hardly any sign that Kimi was slowing down or not holding his position, yet it looks like Ferrari wanted Vettel ahead and told him to pit.

There is in fact a difference of opinions about the pit stop; did Kimi ask for it, or was he told to stop. Kimi said he obeyed the team.

Not the first time pit stops are used to switch the order in a team either!!

That's why I hate pit stops; they end up being manipulative tools for team managers.

 

Kimi did not ask for a pitstop. Where is that coming from? He asked if they were sure.

Hamilton was way faster than Bottas and might have had a shot at winning, that is a reasonable use of team orders.

 

I really don't get all this "conspiracy theory" stuff.

We see it all the time that 2 drivers take different strategies.

NEVER did they tell Kimi to back off.
NEVER did they tell Kimi to let Vettel pass
NEVER did they tell Kimi let Vettel win

Vettel STILL had to make up the time on his own. No one "took" time from Kimi.

When Mercedes asked Bottas to move over, that's team orders. Having different pit stop strategies still means Vettel has to win the race by going faster.

Did it work out for Vettel and not Kimi? Sure. But it's been like that for 2 years now. Why are we all surprised?

 

I'm just thinking ahead a little bit, Ferrari has used more engine components than Mercedes so far so we're likely to get penalties quicker...We need as big a cushion as we can get really.

Yep...the Sky crew already figured out (well before any pitstops) that it was the overcut that would work here, not the undercut...Kimi says also that the team asked him to come in, and what we heard on the radio ''So I come in now then?'' was definitely a question, so presumably they where in conversation.

As a driver you want to trust your team to get the best result for you, so to put you into traffic is poor form on Ferrari's part.

I reiterate again (before anyone goes of) that I fully understand the reasoning behind it...I'm sure Kimi does as well but it must hurt so much for him.

 

I don't think the pit wall brain trust deliberately screwed RAI. That would be far fetched. I do believe there's a good chance it was another example of less than astute race management on Ferrari's part.

Of course, if they didn't have these ridiculous, artificial tire rules there would be fewer chances for these tactical fumbles.

 

Kimi was leading Vettel reasonably late in the season last year. Anything can happen. This years drivers championship could come down to Kimi vs Bottas for all we know. Karma would make for a good season!

 

Negative. SF70-H compared to SF16-H are two completely different cars. We have race pace with the W08 compared to the dominant W07. We have the drivers to do it but reliability comes into play later down the road. Vettel started off this year competitively with Lewis...not so for Kimi hence the long term, as Bas has stated, would be to create a buffer which favors Vettels consistency for the WDC pts and both Vettel and Kimi for the WCC should Kimi perform as he chooses...

 

What are you saying "Negative" about?
Kimi wasn't leading Vettel?
Anything can't happen?
The championship couldn't come down to Kimi vs Bottas?
Karma wouldn't make for a good season?

These were just some facts (other than maybe the Karma one, that was my opinion )

 

Button to receive 3 place penalty for next race for collision with Wehrlein. Plus 2 penalty points.

Will not be transferred to Alonso.

 

Making a comparison from last year to this year is negative. Your right about last year. This year is a completely 180...look where we are in pts this time compared to last year with the Mercs. Last year the Mercs had the WCC with 4 races to go I believe...way ahead of everyone else.

As far as the anything can happen? Well, a global killer meteor could kill us tomorrow then?

and setting a foundation for karma with regards to Kimi and Bottas this season...I doubt it.

 

My comparison to last season had only to do with how the "number 1" driver isn't always leading. Things happen. No one was saying that Kimi was faster than Vettel last season, he wasn't, but Vettel had bad luck that led to him not scoring as many points.

 

copy that. Vettel wants #5 this year...he has the drive and the car and the team behind him to do it. Kimi needs to be in front of or right behind Vettel, just like to today, to take the WCC.

 

GREAT result. Unfortunately Monaco is not a representative race of the championship so let´s not build too much hype.

And now for something completely different, do I think that Ferrari deliberately switched positions between Raikkonen and Vettel?

If the answer is no, I could argue that Raikkonen was loosing steam with his old tyres while Vettel managed to save them for the end of the stint. Also, Red Bull did the same and do you think that they prefer Ricciardo over their wunderkind Verstappen?

If the answer is yes, then WELL DONE! Vettel is way ahead in the championship so the team must do what must be done. Raikkonen may not like it but I think he´s smart enough to know what his situation within the team is and that he´s running on borrowed time so he hasn´t got any other option.

 

Guys, it is pretty simple. Seb was faster but could not get around Kimi. When Kimi pitted, it gave Vettel clean air and he threw down some very quick laps, which gave him a couple of seconds in hand. The pit times were not significantly different, which means that Ferrari did not hold up Kimi. He entered the race behind some cars and was not as quick as when he was in the lead. Seb cranked out great times, and took the race.

 

Yesterday, actually, I predicted the overcut would be the best route to victory in one of these threads! and also that if elton got in the points, ferrari might switch them, if not, they may not feel the points were necessary. Unfortunately for Kimi, the points ARE necessary, but it wasn't the team that screwed him, it was simply normal protocol in pitting the leader first that meant vettel hopped him, and if it weren't for traffic, he would not have done. Ferrari had reacted to bottles, and that was it, so if anyone one screwed kimi, it was Mercedes