Yes and no. Say you manage to purchase an ex-Johnson Falcon and wanted to exercise it properly. You look around and see that they have a Historic Group A class. Excellent. You enter and off you go racing. You end up running around the end of the field all by yourself as everybody else pisses off into the distance ... You either have to give up originality, sell it likely for a loss because now everybody has seen how slow it is, or park it in your lounge and just look at it. End result is a whole lot of really, really, really cool, good and damn interesting historic cars are no longer racing, and the ones that are are debate-ably replicas. Is this want the historic racing community wants?, all because some owners have tiny balls ... and don't get it. But we've probably had this chat before, and yes I understand racing original cars causes them slowly to need replacement parts, but racing to win requires modifications and that is uncool for a historic car IMO. Pete
In practice, there are plenty of Group A cars that are well preserved and competing - Phillip Island this year had a good field. Mixed in are recreations with cheat engines of course, but everyone knows who is who and what is what. Whether you are running first or last, after 5 or 6 laps the field is spread out anyway. The important thing is having 3 or 4 cars of similar lap times that you can race against. Mate of mine runs an XU1 which is reasonably period correct and he has a hoot dicing with the other cars of similar performance. Not my thing, I watch those TCM cars rolling and lurching around and think ugh - give me the instant reactions and precision of an open wheel car any day
When I started circuit racing, no matter where I was in the pack, there was always someone to chase/stay in front of. It still didn't stop you from pushing harder, lightening the car, etc, etc. Oh, and a lightweight E-type is easily a match for a GTO. They never really had factory support in period and suffered from reliability issues (like any good British car), but they were a weapon, especially considering they were a modified road car, and not a factory built race car.
OK, I'll bite No e-Type ever beat a GTO in period. The 3 litre e-type with an alloy engine, built for the WSC, was a complete failure. Jaguar has never won a WSC title. The 250GTO was not a factory race car, it was a homologation car built to WSC rules, based on the 250SWB. I'm sure you know this Hear's the 1963 Goodwood Tourist Trophy, won by Hill in a GTO. Not a WSC event, note that the 3.8litre e-types are behind the 3 litre GTO's (and an Aston) on the front row. Image Unavailable, Please Login
The GTO had way better handling balance. This is why it out qualified the E-type and won races ... In historic racing you should not be lightening the car, etc. just driving it as it was. You don't get it either ... sigh. Pete
LOL! Lets talk 250LM's to hopefully make my point regarding the failings of Historic Racing. David Piper has what is regarded the fastest 250LM currently in the world, as it has been constantly improved and modified with modern solutions. If all 250LM's had been continually raced to "WIN" like that we would have lost them all and they would all now look like Aussie/NZ club specials, like the Alfa Romeo P3's did back in the day in NZ. Basically ****ed. Historic racing needs to be ruled by an iron fist with participators immediately sent home if any modification is found, or any over driving is experienced. The sole purpose of historic racing is to PRESERVE these wonderful old cars. Yes they should be raced, but it should be like we have time traveled back to when they were new, but without the seriousness of results. If you want to really race your old car, join a modern car club and race it there and yes lighten and bang panels and enjoy yourself in real racing . Just my opinion but Touring Car Masters has got it all wrong, basically because these old cars were slow pieces of **** that no longer excite the retired professional drivers. Pete
Sorry, I didn't quite catch that BTW, I know the GTO was more successful, but Jaguar didn't put anything like the resources into the lightweight E-type that Ferrari put into the GTO. When the bugs have been ironed out, as they are today with current owners, they go pretty well against the GTO.
What you really mean is when they have been totally rebuilt using all modern techniques and materials, by owners such as Adrian Newey (what would he know?), they then go ok against $50M pieces of art. Sort of like the opposite to having moretti fettle your car. (in tracksuit pants)
Yes, I once came up against a Mustang in Targa that looked like it was built by NASA. I would have thought that the rules would be a bit stricter in something like the Goodwood Revival.
Yes, yes, yes big mistake. If you'd thrown in a pair of tracksuit pants we could have secured a deal though.
I tried finding something relevant for his original yellow beasty and couldn't,so go for it KIAI. Sorry that's incorrect,there was an advert that should have gone up but I suspect it's old and sold which is why it didn't link. http://www.my105.com/ListingDetails/id/8982
It appears first lap pile-ups are common in Touring Car Masters. Do a quick YouTube search and watch them destroying themselves. I have to admit there are some fantastic crashes, if you are into such things ... So I no longer feel sorry for the owners and old cars, they knew what they were getting in to. Pete
