550 Maranello @ Goodwood Festival of Speed

Hi guys,

Just seen this as I was browsing the Bonhams Goodwood sale. Shame because I was looking for black interior and then settled for tan. If only this came up six months ago!

Question is; a 1999 with low Miles for £70000 or $90000. Where's the market headed.

Bonhams : 1999 Ferrari 550 Maranello Coupé Chassis no. ZFFZR49B000114351

 

Buyer's premium of 20-25%? Is that normal?

 

I settled for black and wanted tan...

Have 2001 550 w/ 15.5K miles

Jack

PM 433rdmaw

 

and i think you have to pay VAT above that...

 

I've since got a 1997 model with 14000 Miles. It's got tan. Don't think I can afford two!

 

Bonhams : United Kingdom

Think it's 15% upto £50000 then 12% over that.

Assuming at £70000 it would be approximately £11500.

So at best $105000.

Hmmmmm

 

Says 25% up to £50,000 and 20% up to some other number right on the description.

 

That's ridiculous. Talk about shafting the seller.

 

Yes,these auction houses are getting very greedy,sometimes because their sell through rate is falling,so they need to earn more on the cars that sell. They often have a 10% discretion with the seller,so they can chip him as well. The VAT,currently 20% in Europe,is charged to the buyer on the commission,not the selling price.

 

As far as estimates, the days of high estimates are over. For a car under 200k, the big boys (RM) aren't going to let you have a reserve. Bonhams will, but the reserve has to be low enough that they know the car will sell. Hence the low estimate on this car at Goodwood.

Low estimates bring out the bidders, and this is the new normal.

Scott

 

Taz, that figure applies to the automobilia (toy cars, mascots, etc) and not to the actual cars.
But still a buyer's premium on the cars of 15 percent/12 percent (plus VAT), is definitely higher than most. Plus the sellers are paying 5-10% to list the cars. So the house is making out very well.

Scott

 

It lived in Japan and a Japan LHD car is always discounted here, fairly or otherwise. More so if it was a Euro LHD car which then went to Japan and is now in the UK. An excellent F512M with a similar story belonging to a Fchatter based in Tokyo sold at probably 40% below market to another Fchatter last year at UK auction.

I think the estimate is about right. Its story makes it discounted to a Euro LHD car here, which is in any case discounted compared to a RHD car; I think this car is worth around 60% of a similar UK RHD car, making it worth somewhere around £70-£75k to the purchaser. If £70k is the reserve, then a purchaser here will be paying more than that with commission, and you can find a Euro LHD non-Japan 550 on the open market for less.

Nothing against the car which looks very nice, but it's not a good time to sell, particularly with stories.

 

Themaven. Why is a Japan car worth less? Yes what you say regards Japan cars does hold true to a certain extent. However for as long as I remember this was always negative stigma perpetuated by the UK dealers to keep the overseas car prices at bay.

For example, I purchased my Porsche 964 RS in Tokyo in 2002. At the time, my local Porsche dealer wouldn't touch the car. Fast forward to 2014 and they were importing classic Porsche's and selling them!

My 550 is an ex Japan car and it's condition is much better than others I had seen for sale. Which was further re confirmed when the car under went 2 separate pre purchase inspections prior to purchase in the U.K. One by a specialist and another by Ferrari dealer. I purchased it in the last year.

Ps any links to Euro LHD cars for sale at below £70000? Would be very curious to see where they are hiding!

 

It's a good question. Lots of debate about that on the TR forum during the time of this particular F512M sale. Negatives centre around a car's history being difficult to check out, documents in Japanese, the usual. Positives seem to be that Japan cars are subject to stringent biannual tests and generally looked after.
All in all its another story to add to a car, and when the market's flat like it is now, that makes for another reason for a car not to sell.
From what I hear, many Japan cars are in excellent condition, looked after maniacally, and so on. And you know, some dealers will tell you a Japan car is worth a big discount, unless they have one to sell..
Speaking of 964s, Hexagon have a Euro LHD Speedster for sale new, ex Japan, fabulous condition, priced 50% under LHD Speedsters in Germany.
So you could say they are bargains..until it's time to sell them!
Now on the numbers, I certainly haven't seen Euro LHD Maranellos for less than 70k here. I mentioned I thought the car at the auction was maybe worth 70-75k including commission..meaning a similar Euro LHD non Japan car would be maybe 75-85k..just my feeling. There was a Euro LHD red/black 550 with maybe 30k km up for 75k around a month ago, reduced from 85k, at I think Arjun Auto.

 

Thank you for clarifying that, commendable response and insightful.

I see your point of view but I may be in the minority with that I would ideally purchase from Japan, especially Tokyo as the cars are driven little and in generally good condition. I say this more because I had lived there for some years.


Now if only I could afford a Speedster to go alongside the 550.

Thanks again

 

In my mind there is no difference in price if a European delivered car like this one was once in its lifetime in Japan. It has British papers so all taxes and duties are paid.
Car with Euro specs first delivered to Japan is a complete other thing.
Just my two cts.

 

My '99 Maranello was imported from Japan. Was well maintained but everything being in Japanese doesnt help. Car has around 20k miles and I landed it after all was said and done for a nearly 30% discount to others on the Canadian market.

I bought it to drive though...and would be buying from Japan over local any day of the week if it means im saving 30% for what is essentially the identical product.

 

Well said...50000kms and growing! Bought it to drive and not just to look at! Will do it again should our Canadian dollar strengthen vs the Yen

 

This is not a Japanese car BTW...there should be a J in the Vin! Its is a eurospec car per the Vin...

 

First delivery to Denmark, so original Euro car...

 

Yes, I know. It may discount a car even more if it is Euro to Japan and back to U.K. than if it was an echt Japan market car. Not saying this should be the case but it is. I used to buy LHD cars from Germany to drive in the UK for the same reason, discounted price, better condition...for driving, it's a good option. But lots of people not buying to drive I suspect.

That Speedster, for example is better than anything I have seen in Europe recently, big discount, not selling.

 

Darius- Makes you wonder. It is not like they get sea-sick or something.

 

I personally believe all this dogma about euro gone to Japan etc is a whole load of nonsense. So now in Hong Kong I have my British registered Jaguar E Type. So when I do take it back to UK, it's supposedly worth less...

If the car is good, with history. This one I saw has been done by Ferrari dealership and at a reasonable market value price then what's not to like.

 

i know. I don't agree with the way it is either.

Calcifer, your E Type is different. If you take it to HK, live with it there, and bring it back, that's a single traceable expat owner, and arguably makes zero difference to its value. The 550 in question was bought in Denmark as a LHD, lived in Japan with people we don't know, for many years, with what an auction house calls 'service history' (one or two stamps in Japanese?), and is being auctioned back here in a RHD country. Not the same.

I mean, in terms of perceived value. Quite possibly a great car, as that Euro-Japan F512M was. But at the moment, the market will punish it.

 

It doesn't really matter what the reasons are. The bottom line is that the UK market prices cars for from Japan LHD cars at least 20% below Euro LHD. Add in the fact that it started life in Denmark and the fact that there is a slightly vague reference to to 'details of previous services on file' and the estimate makes sense. If the low mileage on a LHD is not totally verifiable buyers assume the worst.

Provenance and water tight history is all on these cars, especially at the moment when there are relatively few buyers around.

Somebody may well 'grab a bargain' here, until they try to sell it!