Brake System Failure Light | FerrariChat

Brake System Failure Light

Discussion in '308/328' started by ragtop1, Aug 23, 2017.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    I just had a shop replace all brake pads, rebuild rear calipers and bleed the system. Today when I started the car, the "Brake System Failure" light came on.
    I have driven about 200 miles since the service. I did drive the car a short distance today and the brakes feel perfect. What is the car trying to tell me?

    fluid reservoir is full
    no leaking calipers
    brakes aren't spongy
    car doesn't pull on hard braking

    79 GTS
     
  2. John M

    John M Formula Junior

    Nov 18, 2004
    887
    Kentucky
    I am pretty sure that light is tied to the master cylinder reservoir level. That thing if I remember right has two chambers, and one of them is indicating low. Could be from a faulty sender, a leak, or perhaps wasn't topped back off after the service.
     
  3. dflett

    dflett Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 24, 2005
    1,632
    NY
    Full Name:
    David
    On a 79 I think the light is connected to the brake bias proportioning valve located on the bulkhead near the steering rack. If the plunger is stuck out of position the light illuminates if I remember well. Maybe it got stuck when they bled the brakes?

    Regards
    David
     
  4. Steve King

    Steve King F1 Rookie

    Feb 15, 2001
    4,367
    NY
    Those would be the two areas to look at as they both trigger the brake warning light. Check the brake fluid switch in the MC bottle first and if it works then the bias switch under the car is the most likely problem. It has a ground wire on it and if you unplug it and the light goes out then you found the problem. If it is it then it is a rubber plug that has a thin blade contact that is centered in the housing. The problem is if the valve shifted during the brake bleed you need to recenter it.
     
  5. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    Thank you gentlemen for your responses!
    I will try my luck on the weekend.
    cheers
     
  6. spirot

    spirot F1 World Champ

    Dec 12, 2005
    15,142
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Tom Spiro
    Ding Ding - we have a winner. Most likely some dirt debris causing the valve to be stuck. its a very underwhelming piece of engineering... but a PITA to get to .
     
  7. spirot

    spirot F1 World Champ

    Dec 12, 2005
    15,142
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Tom Spiro
    this is most likely the cause. debris / dirt causing the valve to stick.... its a pita to access and change but pretty easy once in there. but you have to re bleed the brakes again....
     
  8. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    Great !, thanks Tom
     
  9. dflett

    dflett Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 24, 2005
    1,632
    NY
    Full Name:
    David
    Here are photos of the carb car bias valve for those interested.

    First shot is from above the steering rack showing it on the bulkhead below/behind.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    Second photo is a close up of the valve and the electrical connection to the internal switch.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    Unless your inner tub is removed, access is from the small panel in the floor.
     
  10. dflett

    dflett Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 24, 2005
    1,632
    NY
    Full Name:
    David
    If I remember well its made by Girling and loooong NLA
     
  11. LA_Dino

    LA_Dino Rookie

    Oct 11, 2016
    16
    Same thing happened to me. It had uneven levels on both sides of the reservoir, but righted itself eventually. However, it didn't take 200 miles to do it.
     
  12. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    Dave...thank you for the photos. Man, I would be afraid to open that part for fear of damaging something. I doubt if mine is any cleaner than yours. If the valve is just sticking, would a few taps with a hammer loosen it, or do I have to go in there ?
     
  13. dflett

    dflett Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 24, 2005
    1,632
    NY
    Full Name:
    David


    If it were me, I'd want to open it up as I would not want any possible debris finding its way to the calipers. Once I confirmed that switch was the cause of the light though.
     
  14. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    Thanks to all for your diagnostics. It turns out that the low fluid sensor connections were corroded and two pins were broken. Since they weren't making contact, the sensor was indicating low fluid which of course flipped the brake failure light. The connections are round and I don't have any. Will look for some tomorrow at my local auto parts store.
     
  15. GT4 Joe

    GT4 Joe Formula Junior

    Oct 19, 2010
    835
    Dana Point, Ca.
    Full Name:
    Joe Williams
    The stuck switch is probably the cause of the light if you've checked all the obvious stuff. Any debris in the fluid should be purged with bleeding. So, remove the switch, ( it is a PITA to get to) disassemble and clean all parts of it thoroughly. Reinstall and bleed, test drive. If the valve/switch is stuck, you will NOT be getting the proper front/rear brake bias that the factory set up. Please, don't take shortcuts on your brake system. I did this on my X GT4 and it made my brakes positive and responsive as designed, where they were previously a little soft and quite frankly, dangerous.
     
  16. ragtop1

    ragtop1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2006
    5,245
    Ontario
    Full Name:
    Larry Warren
    #17 ragtop1, Aug 26, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The connections were corroded and broken. freshly cleaned and repaired. Brake system failure light now off.
    Thank you for everyone's feed back
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     

Share This Page