MCLAREN 720S OR 488 | Page 55 | FerrariChat

MCLAREN 720S OR 488

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by doccharlie954, Jun 7, 2017.

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  1. frefan

    frefan F1 Veteran

    Apr 21, 2004
    7,370
    yknow there are lots of other places besides the ring to drive a sports car. 99.9% don't care about the ring or whether a 650 scrapes there. personally I would just go to another track that is actually maintained and safe to drive. its a big nuthingburger and a waste of bits in the context of this thread.

    Perhaps a more relevant discussion would be how the stock ride height on a 458/488 is too high (look at how many folks lower their car with Novitec springs). Press cars are lowered and media pics are doctored up to make the car look lower than it is. whereas the 675/720 looks just right. Thats because of its superior suspension. Which is way more interesting than ring times.
     
  2. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    98,533
    Vegas baby
    [
    Really ? So how many here have actually driven a 720s or 488?
     
  3. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    7,658
    Bournemouth, UK
    A good car will be "communicative" even at lower speeds. Not all drivers can get the difference though. A friend of mine doesn't understand the difference in steering feel between his 430 and his SUV and he is a car guy through and through, doing track days and having vast automotive knowledge!
     
  4. graphicdisorder

    graphicdisorder Formula Junior

    Jan 11, 2015
    410
    Johnson City, TN
    Very few here have driven both. Even the ones who have probably haven't put many on one of the 2.

    I have put almost 6k miles on my 488.
     
  5. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

    Dec 9, 2014
    3,577
    Canada
    I will put on about 5000 kms per season which is only about 7 months in our climate. I will henceforth, ignore all your posts as they not only lack any credibility, they are a waste of space and time.
     
    SoCal to az likes this.
  6. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Jan 21, 2008
    4,612
    Los Angeles
    Full Name:
    Mike
    LOL. You barely even drive it. I bet 4000 of those km are highway miles too! I can't wait to see your ad when you sell it, "Used 456, never tracked, mostly highway miles, excellent condition."

    I put 18K miles on my R8 and 7K miles on my McLaren, and I barely even drove them.

    Hmm, so yeah, I guess that means my credibility is beyond yours.
     
  7. Valentino Toro

    May 28, 2017
    37
    Chill, your thoughts are erroneous. But what IS accurate is the fact that I know much more about the development and engineering side than you I'm afraid. I've checked out a lot of your previous posts, that's why I'm sure. Please don't feel intimidated by that.
     
  8. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 13, 2015
    4,896
    Scottsdale/Pittsburgh
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Who cares? You have 9 posts and your first few were so asinine they deserved to be called out. If you were capable of writing properly why didn't you just do that from the beginning?
     
  9. MagicMikeAtl

    MagicMikeAtl Rookie

    Aug 24, 2017
    20
    #1359 MagicMikeAtl, Oct 8, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2017

    Well I've owned two 488's. Have driven the 720S several times (also have owned 6 McLaren's). NO COMPARISON performance-wise. Virtually nothing on the road outperforms the 720S (speed and handling). My 675LT would leave my 488 GTB standing still and the 720S will roast the 675LT. My buddy routinely embarrasses me in his 720S vs. my Supercharged RWD Huracan (800+HP) on roll starts. From a stop, I wouldn't even try. And the 720S is very precise and smooth. Those things are registering 720hp+ WHP on dynos. McLaren pulled a fast one (pun intended ;).

    To add a bit to the original topic in question, depreciation: The McLaren will drop like a rock. They all do. They are NOT sold out. Took me 24 hours to round up a couple for sale. By the next week, I found 6. McLaren overbuilds and the values simply don't hold. They've already announced Spider and LT versions, even before the coupe was released. I am glad I passed on my 675LT Spider. What a hit those guys are taking on value.

    I didn't do well on my 488s either. Dropped horribly Nothing like the previous generations (430/458) in terms of holding value.

    Incidentally, after owning the 488's, I bought the 458 Spider and like it more. This is of course a simple matter of opinion, but I'll sacrifice the speed for the raw race car feel and sound and far more overall "connected" experience of driving the 458 over the 488.
     
    Lone Wolf likes this.
  10. Valentino Toro

    May 28, 2017
    37
    Looks like you care. Drop it and move on, there're more important topics to discuss here.
     
  11. Zlaatan

    Zlaatan Formula Junior

    Sep 2, 2005
    352
    This thread is starting to look like a youtube comment section.. and no that's not a good thing, at all.
     
    JimPVB likes this.
  12. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

    Dec 9, 2014
    3,577
    Canada
    You are not going to be liked on this forum. Your post will in all likelihood be largely ignored.
     
  13. redcaruser

    redcaruser Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 8, 2012
    2,419
    switzerland
    Full Name:
    daniel
    Someone who bought six McLaren's (and two 488) just to find out that the 458 is the MUCH better car will be for sure a hero in this forum! ;)
     
  14. aazizkhalid

    aazizkhalid Karting

    Aug 4, 2012
    72
    DUBAI UAE
    Having bought a mclaren once (650s) , I will never go out of the ferrari marque ever! I own a Speciale and 488 spider and I wish I had the garage space to buy the 812 as well! The class the sound the thrill the pedigree the owners clubs the sheer pleasure of the down shifts, even the logo, ferrari is very special... mclaren can produce the fastest great handling safest whatevers I don't give a damn... If ferrari keeps producing great cars I'll keep buying them, if they ever stop producing great cars I'll keep the ones I have, but I'm not leaving this Marque ever again! This 720 will look dated in 3 years and and the 8xx will soon be the greatest ever from mclaren and no one will want a 720.. whereas people will still want and love a 458 and 430 a 599 and almost any ferrari ever produced.. that's ferrari, they are timeless... if a ferrari doesn't satisfy you and gives you the biggest grin nothing else will, coz 2.8s to 100 is very similar to 3.0s 99% of the time and that really isn't the yard stick to measure a great car.. Go Get a ferrari drive it crazy and admire it, for technology get the iPhone X


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  15. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Jun 23, 2003
    100,524
    Melbourne, Australia
    Full Name:
    Peter
    You were doing so well until that last bit!
     
  16. aazizkhalid

    aazizkhalid Karting

    Aug 4, 2012
    72
    DUBAI UAE
    Lol


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  17. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Jan 21, 2008
    4,612
    Los Angeles
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Who really still wants a 599 or 430?
     
  18. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    98,533
    Vegas baby
    I liked my F430 spider much more than the 458 spider. First it felt more like a real convertible because of the soft top and how far it went down but mainly because it was much more organic and less digital.

    One of the best things with the top down is putting it in RACE mode and listening to the gears slam themselves as you shift the F1 up and down. The 458 was just "shift, go... shift... go". No emotion.

    Not every technological marvel makes a better driving experience. IMO, the super car industry has been going backwards for years in that category.
     
    stan996turbo and redcaruser like this.
  19. frefan

    frefan F1 Veteran

    Apr 21, 2004
    7,370
    yup; still my all-time favorite car is the F40 despite having many of the supercars/hypercars since then. Its the last real drivers car of the lot. slow by todays standard but never ceases to impress. always reminding you whos in charge and what real driving "used to be like". wrong gear, wrong boost too bad you shoulda been paying more attention. a seriously technical car without any technology. but then I could see the same thing about a 375GBT. P1 (ironically) is very close to that feel. but in a modern way.
     
  20. vrdjs

    vrdjs Karting

    Oct 28, 2013
    242
    Los Angeles, CA
    Personally, I do not own a 720s. So I can't truly speak for that car in terms of ownership. But I DO own a 650s and I own a 488 Spider, so perhaps I can contribute a little to the conversation. Everything that has been said about the McLaren has held true for me as well. The electronics are wonky, the back up camera sucks, the brakes needed fixing in the first month I had it and, yes, it scrapes on just about everything which has cost me several K to keep patching the front splitter because an new one is about 7K and I just can't do it. It's ridiculous.

    That being said, the 650s is an awesome car. I know it's not a 720s and the 720 is MILES better than a 650 that you can by for under 200K now. BUT, it does give one a feeling for the company, and the way they build their cars and the differences you feel when driving a Ferrari. The 650s is VERY different than the Ferrari. Different, in feel, sound, comfort, power delivery, everything. The 650 is actually much roomier, at least for me, than the 488. I'm a little over 6'4" and I drive the McLaren as my daily in extreme comfort. (I have to squeeze myself into the 488 and the headroom is terrible.) The McLaren is not super loud (some complain, I don't mind), it's got a nice feeling simple, functional cabin, top up or top down. The controls are impossible to figure out, but I'm probably just an idiot and haven't taken the time to sit with the manual. The car it handles like a go kart and goes like a bat out of hell. It's just a really amazing machine that feels like a race car, looks pretty cool, and I can tell you that EVERY time I drive it, someone either stops me to take a picture, or waves, smiles, etc. It's a bit of a Unicorn and car folks really appreciate seeing one. Now let's talk about a HUGE issue --

    Depreciation. McLaren is a young company by car company standards. As such, they have done little to protect the resale value of their cars as Ferrari now does (or at least tries to do). My car was 313K new and is now worth about 195K. For those of you keeping score at home, that's 37.699% depreciation in the first year! It's insane and incredibly frustrating. I actually tried to sell the car for at one point to make room for the 488, but could never find a buyer. Turns out I'm kind of glad, because I'm now just driving it every day, putting on miles and loving the crap out of it.

    When the 650s first came out, all you saw were videos and articles about it being the best car ever, blowing away the 12c, etc, etc. And at the time, that was true, mostly. It was a revelation. A revelation that lost over 100K of it's value in 11 months. So now we have the 720s coming out. I've driven one and they are, again, bonkers. Unreal. I'm not sure it "blows the 650s out of the water". But, it's a true marvel. A marvel that, I feel, will also depreciate much like its predecessor. But that's just me. I hope I'm wrong and things turn around. I love the company and I want them to do well. Someday I hope to own a 720s. But I will buy it used!

    The Ferrari 488. I've owned 5 Ferraris now and I can honestly say that the 488 is my favorite of all of them. It sounds fantastic. It, too, is powerful, but almost in a scarier way than the 650s. Weird, I know. Maybe it's just that I've had the 650 longer and feel more comfortable going fast in it. The interior of the 488 is a work of art. The alcantara diamond seats with the red stitching, carbon driving zone, etc. It's beautiful to look at. It even smells amazing. The black exterior is really simple, no carbon, but I think it looks pretty good. But, I always buy black cars so of course I would think that.

    At the end of the day, the performance numbers on the two cars are very similar. They are both mid engine turbo charged V8s. They both go really fast. And they both attract attention if that is what you are looking for. Here's the big difference for me: When I step into a Ferrari, I get an emotional response that I don't get with any other brand of automobile. It's nothing quantifiable. It's just a feeling. Ferrari owners know what I'm talking about. It's that rush you get when you sit in that seat and look around and push the start button and hear the engine come to life. It's pure exhilaration. The McLaren is fun. It's cool. But there is no emotion there, for me at least. Ferrari's are just special. They are strangely magical. I know. It's getting ridiculous. I sound like an idiot and I fully expect to get bashed for all of this. But, that's fine.

    I guess the point I'm trying to make is that although I love the 650s. It drives well, it's fast, catches attention, everything you would want from a supercar, except for one small thing -- It's not a Ferrari.
     
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  21. cpiguy

    cpiguy Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 3, 2007
    2,107
    Westlake Village, CA
    Full Name:
    Arnie Friedman
    Thanks for you candid prospective... refreshing
     
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  22. vrdjs

    vrdjs Karting

    Oct 28, 2013
    242
    Los Angeles, CA
    Thank you. You never know how folks are going to react to a post. Much appreciated!
     
  23. Aircon

    Aircon Ten Time F1 World Champ
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    Jun 23, 2003
    100,524
    Melbourne, Australia
    Full Name:
    Peter
    Great write up.... Thanks for taking the time.
     
  24. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Jun 10, 2016
    4,066
    Australia
    Never driven the ring - 99% of my driving is with friends of like mind in environments where we can properly connect with (and exploit) the car. Speed limited freeways and around cities is just a complete waste of time (and mileage to me) - better to drive an SUV or something else. These 99% you refer to - if they were truly putting enough miles on their cars in sporty driving environments (not talking smooth race circuits either) it would be a different story i'm sure.

    Lowering only further limits where you can drive and exploit these types of cars. The manufacturers' (or should i say some :)) engineer theír cars so they can be properly exploited in sporty driving environments. So why defeat that for the sake of vanity? And scraping a low front spoiler here and there is a lot different to having the suspension totally bottom out hard like what I've seen happen - the vid showing it still goes on with 720 and, i'm just not seeing that happen with 458, 488 or 911's in these conditions (at stock height).
     
  25. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Jun 10, 2016
    4,066
    Australia
    Rest be assured we don't waste mileage driving our cars 1000kms down boring freeways to service departments - I'd personally be putting mine on a flatbed rather than doing that. 1000kms over a day and a bit for us sees a very good workout for both car and driver ;)
     

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