I sure that I can buy an equivalent part for less that what I would be charged by a shop since I have the time and freedom the search world wire for the part. But that's not the point. What I would object to is if a shop charged me more than I could buy the part for from the same supplier. Example, a shop buys a part at discount from NAPA and charges me NAPA retail. I'm fine with that even though I can probably by it cheaper from Rock Auto. I respect that the shop "needs it now" and will deal with a local supplier. But I would not be ok with it if the shop charged me 150% of NAPA retail. On the other hand, most of the time it's more like bring the car in for a specified service for which a quote has been given. If I accept the quote for the job I could care less how the invoice reads as I had agreed to the job at a set price. With unknown problems the shops/dealers I have dealt with will ask me to authorize up to $XX to diagnose the problem and come back with a repair estimate. My authorization is required to proceed.
John - when you are do for a major, it will be interesting times. Be sure to post the video of your discussion with the shop when you tell them how it's going to go down Merry Christmas my friend
Your in a rough business my friend. I did that for 25 years retired in 2001 from it. My monthly break even was 880k . My hair is no longer grey
May try to sell in next two years. Smaller operation but same local in continuous operation for 63 years. Nearly $3m in annual sales. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeah I cant imagine how your getting squeezed on parts labor and level of work today. Scaling down and do what works best is very possible. I thought of a small place cash only but said nahhhhh Just going to grab a autorobot for my pleasure in the back yard to keep active, it relaxes me Would love to see you shop one day!!! Merry Christmas and best of luck,
Not an excuse I’ve been busy celebrating pop culture. John, you are smart enough, wise enough. Think about it. A Van Gogh, a Rembrandt sold for millions. Someone decide that’s how much the paintings worth and someone bought it. The price was set. The next person is expect to pay a little more if he wants it on his wall. So whose to say how much a 355 is worth, the owners do. That’s right we do. The problem is unlike a Van Gogh, there are many 355 hence there are many owners. That’s the problem. Too many of us own a 355. Getting everyone to agree on an average price parallels the cost of achieving peace in the Middle East. It’s not going to happen. Reason being some of us acquired the 355 for the wrong reasons; future value, horse power, when the price hit bottom. Now we ***** and main beating the same drum why the 355 value is depressed. Little did we know, we are the problem. Until every 355 falls in the hands of true enthusiasts, it’s value will not be anywhere close to half a mil. But if you look, here is a small light at the end of a long tunnel. It may take awhile. We seem to forget the 355 is the final draft thru years of trail and errors. From 1995 to 1999, no car comparable in all aspects; sight, sound and feel. Today, we can buy more horse power. Today, we can do 60 under 3 seconds. But even with today technology we can not bring back a moment in time. It’s forever trapped in the 355. What’s it worth to me? 300k at the moment. Consider it buying down appreciation years to come.
But the price the restaurant charges for the steak includes labor. Not to worry. The guy I use for the 308 always asks me what I want done. I say nothing and he hands me an invoice for a major. Total cost, $0.00. But I have complete records.
Well, you see, I just don't see Ferraris like that. Particularly my 355. My first Miata was blue. My second Miata was blue. Mt Boxster is blue and my 355 is blue. They are all just blue cars to me. So, 355 values, yea, I just don't get it. I just don't care. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Totally disagree... $40k is completely normal. In the 8 years I had mine, I spent $67k on service/maintenance and that was on a low miles '99 with a fresh major. A small part of that was cosmetic stuff like repainting the bumper and replaceables like tires, but the vast majority was the maintenance schedule and parts simply breaking, often repeatedly. There are a lot of 355s in my area and my local independent always had a few of them in the shop at the same time. The owners would probably never admit it on here but I know for a fact that many of them spent much more than $40k on service, and in some cases those types of bills came in one shot. One of them actually did detail his experience somewhere in the subscribed area a few years ago. I spent about two years looking for the car I eventually bought and most of the classified ads I saw included something along the lines of "recent $20k service.." or "$50k in service receipts.." That's just how it goes with these cars, so your best bet is buying one that's had all the big stuff done already and hoping for the best. But just remember that even if you haven't spent all that money on repairs, the previous owners probably did. If for some reason they do shoot up to hundreds of thousands of dollars the service costs probably won't matter as much but for now the very real possibility of a $20+k bill on a $60k car is tough to stomach for most people. As much as I'd like to get another one, this is the exact reason why I probably never will.
I think the way you get to these figures is as follows: Tubi headers 7k (one time) Major service 12k Valve Guides 5k (one time) New Cats 10k (factory) Misc 3k —————————- 37,000 With a bit of knowledge and research Tubi headers 4K (from Europe) Major service 8k (good independent) Valve guides ? After maket Cats 2k ( or test pipes $600) Misc. less ————————- Much less..... Many of these horror stories were created at Ferrari Stealerships. Time has moved on and there are solutions out there for people that do a little research and acquire some level of knowledge concerning the subject. Being able to do minor repairs with the knowledge on this forum helps too. If you’re going to run to the dealer with every minor issue, they will help you part with your money and then some. It doesn’t have to be this way at all. Say your headers, Cats, & valve guides are good, or have already been done, there isn’t much left to go wrong except the F1. Oh I forgot, you MUST order a new F1 actuator from Ferrari for 23k rather than having yours rebuilt for $3,500. These cars represent a unique driving experience that was very close to a race engine for the time. They are also beautiful. The engine out service every 5 years is expensive, but the rest of the issues are pretty much one time items.
I too was worried about maintenance costs before I bought my 355. However, a friend with a good car collection that includes a 355 told me that his experience was a positive one and that outside of the usual maintenance his car has not been a problem. So I bought my 355 and in 5 years of ownership I have put maybe $5000 CAD (about $4k USD) into it and that includes a $2500 CAD (about $2k USD) ticket to prep the car for a track event (change all fluids, new plugs, new plug wires, etc.) I am getting close to getting a major done so the cost will be going up no doubt but the car has been far from a money pit. In comparison, the Cayenne Turbo I bought a year ago is undergoing a complete engine rebuild at a cost of $30k. And yet people are willing to shell out $150k for a new one.
well said. I highly encourage any 355 owner to use high flow cats or downpipes. I'm convinced the stock cats are culprits adding to the header cracking issues.
There’s nothing to get. Values of anything antique or classic is based on perception and the person weights in the most is the owner. Unfortunately, like I said, the 355 has too many owners. No offense, some of “us” are the Coke Generation. “We” place too much emphasis on power over form. Understandable in those days horse power was hard to come by. That thinking continues to cloud the way “we” think today. Some of “us” can’t wait to sell our 355 to get something with more horses. My moral couldn’t be more different. Horse power is a cheap add on. In the near future every car company will have an electric motor in their cars. The sub 3 seconds time will not be exclusive to the million dollar price tag. Then what, sell whatever flavor of the year “we” have and buy next with more horses? LoL, “we” need to stop chasing waterfall. Find a lake that makes “us” happy and swim. I found my lake. I’m optimistic most 355 will be in the hands of collectors and 355 enthusiasts value between 250 and 500k. Im not selling but actually looking for one everyone hates the most; yellow/creme, Spyder, F1 and low miles. What makes a sport car great is its ability induce pleasure to the driver. We unconsciously think the more horse power, the greater the pleasure. This is probably the second most misunderstood belief to plaque mankind. Pleasure does t come with top speed. In fact pleasure comes in a variety of ways and you have to move breakneck speed. Relax John I’m not talking about the whip, chain and swing set in your special room. I’m talking about velocity. OK, I’m done for today. Everyone go back to your fantasy.
Sorry, but if you spent $67k in service in 8 years you either bought a basket case or you were seriously taken advantage of, or both.
And by the time it's worth that what will that be worth? That I agree with and that is why I still think my Miata were two of the best sports cars I have owned. Miata driver to passenger: That looks like an interesting road. Let's see where it goes. 355 driver: That looks like an interesting road. We'll have to explore it sometime when I have the pickup.
Nope it was a low miles, late 99 build I bought from a Ferrari dealership who did a major right before I bought it. I knew the previous owner and had all receipts going back to when it was new. The first 23k miles or so were relatively flawless, but after that it started getting painful. There were a couple of majors with the usual while-we're-in-there stuff, annuals, multiple clutches, headers, a few steering racks, shocks, many CV boots and thermocouplers, motor mounts, hoses, complete melted interior redo, broken door handle, 360 F1 pump, and a bunch of random small items leaking/breaking over time. Based on what I saw at my local independent, which happens to be one of the most respected shops in the country, this was completely normal. Some guys here came out much worse than I did. Then again I actually drove my car 10-15k miles a year for most of the time I had it, so maybe that's the difference. Well it looks like you have a shop and do all of your own work. Not all of us are in the same position. Also how many miles have you put on the car in that time, and do you have the receipts from the previous owners? I'd be surprised if $5000 is all that's been spent on it.
Yes, I do my own work. Due for a major soon. I bought the car with 9xxx miles - it has just over 15K now. I do have the records from the second owner and it was 2 majors, tires and a windshield replacement. The last major was around $10K including the tires, a few sticky parts, CV boots, etc.
My car cost me almost 20k last year, and that wasn't even a major service Of course out of that the only thing necessary was oil/trans fluid/coolant change.
So how many miles did you put on the car? If you put 80k miles on the car 67k doesn’t sound all that bad.
Wow. $67K, regardless of miles, is eye-watering. The "multiple clutches, headers, few steering racks, shocks..." alone will put repairs in the tens of thousands. Annual fluids alone would be almost $1K at the dealer, assuming you felt it had to be done. 10 years of that is another $10K.
I have to agree with John 67k seems like a lot of overkill. But at 15k miles a year you have 2k in tires per year plus 1k in fluids.
I bought it with 11k and sold it with 53k. In the first few years I kept it at my DC place in the fall/winter and my FL place in spring/summer so I was able to put a lot of miles on it. In the next few years I kept it at my DC place full time and didn't get as much driving time due to weather, but in the last two years I only put about 500 miles on it since it was in the shop for about 20 months or so out of that period with random fixes, waiting on parts, diagnosing issues, etc. I really loved that car but after so many dollars spent I gave up on it. If I added up the total downtime it would easily be over 2 years out of the 8 I had it. I'm not trying to be a schmuck here but the topic of the thread is why these aren't worth more, and several people have said it's the maintenance nightmare so I'm just sharing my experience. As I said before, I know five guys on here in my area who had similar experiences although you probably won't hear about them. Some were worse, some not as bad, but still massively expensive. My point is that if someone spends a million+ on an F40 they won't even flinch when swiping their Centurion card for a $30k service. But 355s are in the working man's realm so the idea that the car you bought last year for $60k needs to go in for a major and they find that it needs a new water pump, clutch, flywheel, valves, headers, cats, and the interior has melted, you're looking at well over $30k, which is getting into divorce territory for most guys.
