Very much so. However, it was a short drive on nice country roads, so I suspect it will remain a front-mid engine feeling on track and thus still less go-kart feel compared to the V8s. On the Castellet (in my F12), it was doable to keep up with the Speciales, but only because of the long straights....
I can only provide you my guesses: I think the 812 would do better because of improvements in the traction systems in the car. I am constantly astounded with the interaction between the e-diff and F1-Trac traction control and the tire compound that provide my F12 on my roads near AWD levels of grip and ability to put the power down. And the 812 will have the latest versions of these systems. When you are on the motorway, unless you are really flooring it, like you eventually did, there isn't much difference between a car with 300hp and a car with 700. Both can maintain relatively high causing speeds. I suspect you easily pulled away from him when you tried. Anyway, I bet the 4WS on the 812 would also help around bends, but don't be so sure the Jag would catch you up a twisty road. And if you were so inclined, you could go to "CT-Off" mode and explore the SSC. Though I wouldn't be that brave on public roads. You are also possibly forgetting driver confidence as an important factor. I bet the Jag is heavier and probably suffers more understeer than the Ferrari. It might come out of corners a little faster due to the AWD. But I bet most drivers would feel more confident in the Ferrari. The F12 is very confidence inspiring and I t think the 812 will be even more so. I agree with Ricardo, when someone tries to get aggressive, I try not to escalate the situation by engaging with them but rather I will say "nice car!" and move over and let them go. But, that's easy to say and hard to do.
Thank you Jerry for your thoughts and explanations about the capabilities of the F12 on twist roads because I haven't explored them yet past the comfort zone. Over here I get very spoiled because when I'm driving the F12 on the motorway I'm used to see the majority of drivers pulling from the left lane to the right as soon as they see from faraway that grey silhouette on their mirrors. That was the only engagement I can recall since I've had my F12 and it was good for my ego.
I believe is very much so Ricardo but I can assure you that I would have pretended the F12 was slower and be very happy to let that Jag go through if I recognized a glorious V12 E type.
When I had my F12 I'd taken the car out probably 1-2 times a month, but now with the 812 I can't wait till the weekend comes around so I can take the car out for spirited drives...it's just so much more fun to drive! Whether it's straight line acceleration or twisty canyon run this awesome machine is in a league of it's own!
My 599 felt enormous compared to previous rear mid cars hence I never bothered with the F12 Thinking it may have improved over a 599 but not quite the nimbleness of my previous V-8's But now with 4WS, numerous other improvements and NA engine I'm willing to give the 812 a try This is my personal take on the situation Not a dig on F12's
Let me be very clear they merit exactly the same treatment as the higher rungs V12's owners because the timeless beauty of the E-type is still there. I'm also a Jag lower, lower rung owner, unfortunately not of an E type as I very much would like, but of a XJ6 4.2 from the 60's which was my father's first jag.
Can you expand on the high praise of the 812 over the F12? My 812 is on the water and plan to keep my F12 but with never driving an 812 would appreciate your input.
In my 35+ years of Ferrari, I've always found that you need to see a car's design in the flesh in order to truly appreciate it's beauty. So I have been reserving judgement on the 812, because before last weekend I had only seen it in photos. Having seen on in the flesh last weekend, I can now say with 100% certainty that it has ZERO appeal to me aesthetically. The very first time I saw an F12, to my eyes it looked like a modern interpretation of a 275GTB, which just happens to be my favorite Ferrari of all time. It was the 275GTB that, when I was a kid, made me fall in love with Ferraris. Seeing some of that in the F12 made it immediately strike a positive emotion with me. But the 812 is...... Good question! Just WHAT IS the design of the 812??? I have no idea. It stirs zero emotion with me, and I don't even think it looks like a Ferrari. I'm sure it does drive better than an F12 in at least some (perhaps many/most) ways.... But if I don't love it's design, that's all for naught. A woman could be intelligent and engaging to be with, but unless I find her to be beautiful, I have no interest.
I have just been on the track at Silverstone in an 812. OMG the car is fast, so fast on the first lap with an instructor, the GeForce made me feel a bit queasy and that was in cold and slightly damp conditions, it seem to have so much more grip than my F12 and I think it was about 5 MPH faster on the straight than my F12. In real would driving, I don't know yet as I have not driven one on road, but I would guess it is even more civilised than my F12. I can't wait to get mine hopefully before the summer ends.
Agreed the 812 is a monster on track and doesn't feel like a large car at all. As a side note, glad to see the F12 which went off doesn't seem to be too badly damaged, apart from the front spoiler.
As they say, sometimes beauty is more than skin deep . I was utterly blown away when I drove an 812 last week. For me it is the perfect balance between the unruly tdf and the more civilised F12.
In September of 2017 FerrariChat member CD (Christian) took some very interesting pictures of his GF F12 parked near a red 812. Because the title of this thread is 812 vs F12 I took the liberty of reposting here some of the pictures and I hope Christian doesn't mind. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
For me, the power increase on the 812 felt clear (the lower gearing might have added to that sense), and but the improved dynamics was the most impressive part. Whether it was the 4WS or the chassis electronics I don't know, but the turn in was super sharp, and I could very confidently feed in the gas through the corners whereas the F12 had just a little less feedback, and a bit harder to judge. I think the steering on the 812 felt a bit more connected, and played a part in inspiring that confidence. I think even on the smooth Bavarian roads, the F12 felt like it rode better than the 812, and the chassis seemed to be less disturbed by road undulations than the 812, which required more corrections with the steering at higher speed. One thing (and I may be imagining this) the 812 felt a bigger car than the F12 in some of the smaller state roads, The 812 engine is absolutely superb (the best sounding car I have ever driven including F12 and tdf). Don't know if the sound is "manufactured" in any way but the top end just screams, and more dramatic especially as it revs more quickly than the F12. The gearshifts felt equally quick in both cars but sound quite different - the 812 sounds a bit more violent even though the shift itself is smooth. The interior, you can clearly tell that the 812 feels more modern, particularly the screens, but really not a lot to choose between the two. Stepping back, it is obvious driving the 812 that it is a "tuned up" F12 in many ways, but the it really took the experience to a different level. Some things were more frantic than the F12 - the noise, the acceleration, and the cornering ability, all going against the grain of GT-ness, but at the same time, it remained absolutely controllable. For a GT-style cruise, I think the F12 has an edge, simply because it feels a bit more relaxed. At the other extreme, I had a chance to drive a friend's tdf last week at the same time, and while it was dartier than the 812 and required real attention, after driving the 812 I came away thinking 812's performance on the road is on par with the TDF but the 812's handling was "TDF done just right" for the road. TDF presumably shines more on the track, but I am not a big fan of flinging GT-sized cars on track. Overall, F12 and 812 are two sensational cars, but if I had to pick one for a full-on driving experience, it would have to be the 812. Oh that engine....can't wait for mine to arrive later this year.
The great news is that you don’t have to buy one. There have been several Ferrari’s in the past that I thought were not beautiful. The 812 is not one of those. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
