Help. Testarossa stuck in gear

when the sleeves are exactly in the middle between the gears with the synchrorings and also the sleeves not touching the synchrorings then all is in neutral. and when then also the selectors are in neutral then in the gearbox all is ok and no gear can be inside.
so good would be if you could make some more photos please:
the selectors in neutral. and don´t shift then or move those selectors.
then please a photo from this selectors again and also 3 more photos of the sleeves from the reverse and 1st gear, then from the 2nd and 3rd and also from the 4th and 5th. then I can tell you if a gear is inside or not. but on the photos I have to see clearly the distance from the sleeve to the synchrorings both sides.

the little play between the synchrorings and the gears are in both ways a little, so up and down and also axial left and right. up and down less play than left and right. but as I told alraedy, only a little bit. I want to get sure that not the synchroring 2nd gear is seized to the gear. so please check all synchrorings for play that you may feel then the difference if the ring second gear would be seized. but even this I never had before at any car/gearbox.

when all would be in "real neutral" ( so it does not matter how the selectors are located, it is only important how the sleeves are located ) then you can move the rear wheels easy, both turning in the same direction. if the selectors then are not in the neutral position please wait before you try to adjust. post photos here first.

the photos with the 2nd gear in post 51 shows exactly how the sleeve and the selectors are in neutral. at that situation you may take additional photos from the sleeves reverse and 1st and 4th and 5th gear. when it looks the same then NO GEAR is inside and all is in neutral

good luck

 

oh ! ! !
have not seen all the pictures in post 52 before I was posting and can not edit my posting. was posting after I read the post 51 and the next post has been on the next page where I was not looking

but now I know what is wrong:
only adjsutment, nothing else. so you are very lucky !

but it is not the 2nd, it is the 3rd gear.
on photo 1 and 2 in your post 52 you see clearly that the sleeve is connected with the synchroring 3rd gear, but not with the gear itself. but this pressure from the synchroring to the cone at the gear is enough to block this gear. but also the sleeve from the reverse and 1st gear touches the synchroring from 1st gear. so all is on the layshaft. may be the complete layshaft was moving backwards to the diff? so the center nut in the front was getting loose? but this I don´t think so.
also it seems nearly impossible that both forks moving on the shaft. so I think if the layshaft has not moved that the small fork controlling ( 106222 ) was moving on the shaft ( 107452 )

as I have written alraedy in post 11 check those sleeve distances because for me the sleeve has not been in the middle but the photo not shows excatly.

you have a WSM? then you try to adjust as it is standing there. not a big deal but needs some time and patient.
good luck

 

you have the WSM?
if so then please read first how to adjust then you know exactly what you are doing.

I would look first if the fork for the 2nd and 3rd gear only moved. I´m sure you would see this on the shaft where the fork is mounted. also have a look if both forks for the layshaft have been moved equal? because this is nearly impossible. have a look how much the sleeves in neutral are away from the center between both gears and synchrorings. left and right have to be the same distance ( always when in neutral ).
worst case would be if both forks and also both small levels not moved, then the layshaft moved. this only can happen when the central nut in front was getting loose

before you start adjusting you may look what and why something moved.

 

yes. I mean this WSM

so wish you good luck

 

Look at the adjustment procedure on the pages of the manual that you have posted. You have to make up a tool to simulate AV1641, which depresses the springs holding the detent balls in place, thus locking the selection rods in the neutral postion. You can make one from a flat steel plate with two holes drilled in it (see Fig 31 in the manual). Then perform the "Adjustment of gearbox inner linkage" as outlined in the manual, which is basically centering the operating sleeves so that the play between the sleeve and the gears is equal on each side of the sleeve.
Also make sure that all three selector forks line up in neutral. I use a piece of square tubing that is ground so it just slides into a selector fork to line up all three forks.

 

then loosen all screws form the 3 forks so the sleeves can go alone in neutral position. then it must be in neutral ! ! !

 

If you pull the ignition wire and crank the car are the gears turning and then if you push in the clutch are the wheels free. I had a clutch disk fracture in a TVR and I could not get it out of gear. The disk jammed itself between the flywheel and pressure plate.

 

now I wonder very much ! ! !

on the picture it shows clearly that the sleeve is in the middle of the 2 gears and synchros from the 2nd and 3rd gear, so no connection then to the layshaft.
could you please post 2 more photos from the sleeves 4th and 5 th gear and also reverse and 1st?

the screws on the 3 forks moving the sleeves are still loosen?

to hold the springs down and the 3 balls is only important for adjusting, not for getting in neutral

next step then is to find out what gear is inside:
so one has to push the clutch, one turn the rearwheels ( so that the diff will not work and both wheels turning the same direction ) and a 3rd one looks at the synchrorings and the sleeves. when the layshaft will turn and for example the 2nd gear is inside, then the gear on the layshaft will turn exactly the same speed as the sleeve. so you may look then at all gears and watch, what gear makes exactly the same speed as the sleeve. then you know what gear is in.

but how go on then? just now I don´t know.

will get hopefully today the last missing bearing for my gearbox and then will put all together and will think again directly working at this gearbox what could this be at your gearbox.

you have written that you will work on the car on sunday and munday. so would be good if you could post the 2 more photos I asked for today. please try to put a light left and right from the sleeves that the shadow is not so much, this sometimes is confusing

 

best would be to mark all synchrorings with a fine edding together with the sleeves, then turn the shafts some times and then look what mark still is matching. this then is the gear what is connected or what is blocked.

 

thank you for the photos

ok Billy. now it is 100 % clear that as you already told the second gear is always in. even the sleeve is not on the synchro and the synchro has a little play. so I think that really the second gear is seized on the needlebearing or welded to the spacer ( 110174 )

you have seen all other markings that they moved and not match anymore?

you may try the following to get this gear loose:
put in the reverse gear, disconnect the two coils ( so not the iginition wires ) and start the engine with the starter. may be because of the knock the 2nd gear will get loose. it is worth a try. so as long as the 2 gears are in the engine will block. but when you try to start several times ( not too long when the engine is not turning ! ! ! max. 1 second ! ! ! ) it always will get a knock to the gearbox and may be the 2nd gear get loose then. but don´t do this more than 5 times in a row. wait then about 15 minutes to let the starter cool down and try again. when the engine turns then you know second gear is loose. of course not push the clutch.

but nevertheless: you have to dismantle the gearbox. but try to get the gear loose as long as the engine is inside. when you later dismantel the gearbox and the gear still is tighten then you will have a very big problem to get it all out.

good luck again

 

Yeah, like bumping free a frozen clutch disk to a flywheel. Worth a try for sure. Unless there is somthing jammed in the gears, but it does not sound like that is the root cause. Good luck.