F355 R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES?? | FerrariChat

F355 R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES??

Discussion in '348/355' started by cvy612hgtc, Aug 5, 2018.

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  1. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    Hi All!

    I'm going through a major service for my '97 355 5.2 Berlinetta Manual, and I'm looking to replace this set of electrical wires but I just can't figure out the part number and what it is. Perhaps somebody can help? I think it's the R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES? As I look for the part it gets confusing since there are so many variations of it where websites show the same looking part with different part numbers.

    Part # 178205 - R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR 355 F1 USA, 355 F1 CDN AND 355 F1 AUS CARS -VA

    Part # 170657 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR USA, CDN AND AUS -NOT FOR 355 F1 CARS

    Part # 174524 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR 355 F1 CARS -NOT FOR 355 F1 USA, 355 F1 CDN AN

    Part # 175038 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR 355 F1 USA, 355 F1 CDN AND 355 F1 AUS CARS -VA

    Part # 168496 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -NOT FOR USA, CDN AND AUS -NOT FOR 355 F1 CARS

    Part # 178204 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR 355 F1 CARS -NOT FOR 355 F1 USA, 355 F1 CDN AN

    I have attached a photo where I have circled the relevant part I'm holding in yellow which might be more helpful and in case I am totally looking in the wrong place! I am based in Hong Kong so RHD. My guess is the correct part is 168496.
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  2. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Nov 23, 2012
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    Orchard Park, NY
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    Dave Lelonek
    Fist off - where are you located? Is this a U.S. car, or Euro? I think that is the main ECU harness?
     
  3. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    I am based in Hong Kong so my guess is that it would be Euro. RHD.
     
  4. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Nov 23, 2012
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    Sorry - I missed you saying that in the first post. You may wish to update your profile. I'll have a look at the parts diagram latter.
     
  5. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    Ian Riddell
    #5 Qavion, Aug 5, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2018
    What is your ECU part number?

    Do you have 3 cat temperature ECUs? USA and Australian cars have 3, so need a special harness. Since USA (LHD) and Australian (RHD) cars have the same harness, it doesn't matter if your car is left or right hand drive. I replaced my Australian car's harness recently. The engine has to come out.

    Make sure you have a good wiring diagram and a multimeter to help you attach the plugs to the correct engine components.

    5.2 Engine Wiring Diagram

    F1 harnesses have an extra wiring branch (and plug) near the ECU plug. Also, there is a resistor hidden in the ECU plug.
     
  6. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Feb 20, 2015
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    P.S. (EDIT) F1 harnesses have an extra wiring branch (and plug with 4 pins) near the ECU plug.

    Here is my latest F1 wiring diagram for those interested:

    5.2 F1 Engine Control Wiring Diagram version 2

    Mr. "cvy612hgtc", my new harness had a fault... Some wires were going to the wrong pins on one of the plugs, causing the SD1 tool not to communicate with the ECU. If you have a similar problem, let me know and I'll tell you how I fixed it.
     
  7. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    T
    Thanks Qavion. My car has a manual shifter (not F1) so hopefully that makes things a bit easier. Since you installed this new harness before, then the first question is whether I am correct looking at the "Side Engine Injection Cables" description for the relevant part? Given the difference with F1 harnesses (thanks for the input very helpful!), it allows me to exclude those parts that are "valid for F1" which narrows it down to the below 2. So if these are the right parts to look for and following your input on the ECUs, it looks like I need to check whether there are 3 CAT temperature ECUs to determine whether I choose the USA, CDN and AUS or the one that isn't. Sounds right to you? I have also attached the relevant diagram I am looking at and my guess is that the correct part is in position 2. Interestingly, it looks like the one that isn't valid for the USA, CDN and AUS is quite a bit cheaper too.
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    Part # 170657 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -VALID FOR USA, CDN AND AUS -NOT FOR 355 F1 CARS
    or
    Part # 168496 -
    R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -NOT FOR USA, CDN AND AUS -NOT FOR 355 F1 CARS
     
  8. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Yes, item "2" is the whole (5.2) wiring harness. On 2.7 cars, you have to worry about left and right harnesses, because there are two ECUs and two harnesses.

    If you look in the rear right hand corner of the engine compartment (behind the wheel arch, near the secondary air pump), you will either see one or two item "42"

    https://www.ricambiamerica.com/car-diagrams/ferrari/v6-v8/355-group/f355-m5-2-1996/air-injection-device.html

    USA and Australian cars have two item 42's. One will be mounted vertically, one will be mounted horizontally. One will be attached to the temperature sensor on the right hand main catalytic converter. The other will go to the temperature sensor mounted aft of the exhaust bypass valve. Euro cars will only have one item 42.
     
  9. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    I have the 170657 because I have a USA/Australian non-F1 car. If you only have one temperature ECU in the right hand rear corner of your car, then 168496 would seem to be the one you want. I assume you haven't got a Challenge car or some other special variation? Your ECU part number may also help identify if you have a USA/Australia type car.
     
  10. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    Incredibly helpful! Wish I had a Challenge, but don't. Will let you know what I find out.
     
  11. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    Does this help? This looks like the part # for "Control Unit Ignition - Valid till Ass. Nr. 26746 - Not for USA, CDN, AUS, SA and ZA - Valid for ABS"
    Believe then I should be getting: Part # 168496 - R.H./L.H. SIDE ENGINE INJECTION CABLES -NOT FOR USA, CDN AND AUS -NOT FOR 355 F1 CARS

    Dr., do you concur?! :)

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  12. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    That would be my conclusion, too. I'm assuming, of course, your car has the correct ECU (i.e. the assembly number of your car is lower than 26746). I'm not sure about the "ABS"... I thought all 355's had ABS, whether it be Teves or Bosch.

    Good luck with the harness change :)
     
  13. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    Confirmed assembly number lower than 26746! But here's the problem...nobody seems to sell that part anymore and apparently Ferrari doesn't make it anymore. A few used ones on the market, but that wouldn't make sense. I will keep looking around though it's worth asking whether anybody has come across a shop that specializes in restoring harnesses. I've seen a few via the internet in the US but it would be better getting a recommendation on one that somebody has actually used before.
     
  14. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Strange. My harness looked newly made (USA/ABS/non-F1). I just ordered it from Eurospares and they got it from the factory. It took one or two months to arrive.

    My previous (wrong) harness was a Euro/ABS/F1 (but higher assembly number than yours), but it was still compatible (apart from missing a bypass valve plug) with my 6 speed gated car. If you could figure out the differences between the harnesses, you may find one that is compatible (with just an extra plug, perhaps, which could be capped and tied back). The ECU pins appear to have common functions. Pins for the F1 system are simply not used on the gated car's ECU. The only things I would worry about would be the brake system ("ABS") and the anti-pollution gear.

    Restoration is also a good option (and probably cheaper). It's only a matter of replacing wires. Colour is not really an issue because you can't see many of the wire colours anyway. Large sections of plastic sheathing may have to be replaced, however. Depending on the number of wires damaged and the location of the damage, you could simply insert splices and re-wrap the harness with silicone self-fusing tape.

    Some FChatters have inserted disconnects in the wiring to make it easier for engine-outs.
     
  15. Beetle

    Beetle Formula Junior

    Apr 10, 2013
    776
    The Ecu plug is readily available. I purchased mine from NZ. For a break out box. If the harness is out of the car and you have a quality continuity meter you will soon find broken wires. And as Ian stated just replace the broken section and re wrap.
     
  16. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    How many wires do you think are damaged? Is there damage only in the area you have circled in your photo?

    If there are only a few wires broken, then you could use those handy waterproof butt splices or "solder sleeves" or whatever they are called. They are used in commercial aviation in some areas.



    Plenty on eBay
     
    Beetle likes this.
  17. 97 Spider

    97 Spider Formula 3

    Dec 15, 2012
    2,241
    Texas
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    Brian
    I haven’t seen anywhere here that you verify what market your car was built for. Obviously the easiest way is the 8th digit of the VIN. Here’s a screenshot from redhead.com, tell us what market the car is from and no one has to guess.

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  18. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    I did check with Eurospares as well and they also confirmed that the part is no longer available from the factory. It could be the other variations of the harness are available though.
     
  19. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    It's all been clarified by the previous posts where we looked at the ECU part number and the assembly number. But in case you were wondering, it would classify as a code C car, RHD UK following your table.
     
  20. cvy612hgtc

    cvy612hgtc Rookie

    Mar 17, 2015
    21
    HONG KONG
    DIdn't know about this. Very cool, thanks!
     

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