Trade 991 TTS for F12?

Long time fan of the brand, but I've yet to dip my toe in. I own a 991 Turbo S that's pretty much good at everything, but I find myself less interested in driving it as time goes by. I'm probably taking it for granted, but I keep thinking about replacing it with a F12. How's the ride quality on less than ideal roads? I've got track cars, so this is strictly for street use. Any thoughts from current/previous owners would be appreciated.

 

It a GT car. So it's very comfortable for daily driving and the power is beast when you needed it. It's more comfortable in my opinion then 911.

 

I forgot a couple things to ask: any fitment issues for 6'2" drivers? For the owners of non-red F12's, do they still attract attention? I prefer to fly under the radar and am thinking it wouldn't get a second glance in dark blue from most people.

 

An f12 attracts attention no matter what color it is. Outside of that... it’s many levels ahead of a Porsche turbo. Turbos are great all around cars but for me they are so boring to drive. The f12 is something else.


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Actually it is a proper front-mid engine supercar, that happens to ride well, like all Ferraris.

 

My experience is the shields tend to attract a lot of the attention. Because they are easily seen at a distance- and are a real contrast point on most colors. I suspect if you were to get a car without shields, or if you were to change them to the CF ones, you would most likely attract less attention. No matter what, when people get close, it is a Ferrari, the silver prancing horse is easily visible, the sound is impossible to mistake for anything else. I think you could fly under the radar most of the time, but it won't be quite the same. On the other hand- you'll be driving a Ferrari!!!!!! I notice you are in Chicago. As to comfort, the few times I've taken my F12 into NYC I noticed on roads that have gentle up and down motion, the suspension can get a little bit "caught out" and the car bounces a bit uncomfortably/ I would describe it as "porpoising"- taking the car out of bumpy road mode helps in this instance. But aside from that I think the ride quality is very good for a "super GT". The car is just wonderful. I hope it works out. Btw- I hate the CF shields. For me the CF shields are like when someone wears a Yankees hat in red. I view it as "wrong" because the shields are steeped in history and feature the color of Modena (yellow) and the national colors of Italy along with of course the Cavallino Rampante and the "SF".

 

Yes. Do it. Unless you want to go the mod route. 991 turbo s can be made faster than pretty much any koeningsegg for very little with the same reliability as oem and as normal to regular driving as oem. If not, just go the f12 route.

 

Regarding fitment, I am 6’6” and fit fine in my F12. Really no issue whatsoever, but every body type is different. I am proportionate legs and body. Regarding flying under the radar, I find the F12 to be extremely discrete. Mine is black with black calipers and shields. It attracts attention from those who know the car. On the other hand, my red Lamborghini Huracan Performante attracts attention from everyone...

 

Recently I received an invitation to attend a Porsche event which took place in a well known racing track but, despite having never owned a Porsche or being a fan of the brand, I went there in order to see the cars and gain a bit more knowledge about this emblematic make . Hundreds of Porsches were on that event, from classics to contemporaries you could find one for every taste, nonetheless I noticed that the majority were 911's. Having attended before a Ferrari event in that same circuit the first thing that became clear was how different it sounded this time. Isn't my intention to be rude but in terms of sonority Porsche can't offer anything even close to a Ferrari V12 or even a Ferrari V8 aspirated. Under the bonnet of the F12 you'll find a symphonic orchestra, with tuned tubes like a church organ, and no doubt that's one of the great charisma elements of the Ferrari f12 Berlinetta. Where it passes or goes is never unnoticed not by the intensity or loudness of the sound produced but due to the purity and variety of it's harmonics. Despite having been launched back in 2012 the F12 continuous being one of the most powerful road GT's available today. All that power around 740 cv's is coming from an aspirated V12 engine and is produced in a certain different manner from the way the Porsche 911 TS engine does it. When the accelerator is pressed down in the F12 you notice no lag whatsoever and one of the "secrets" they say, which is something almost unique today in any road car engine, is that cross plane camshaft which doesn't use counter weights and has almost no inertia.
The F12 is a GT made for the road, that's this car element, and I can assure you by my personal experience that even if you travel non stop for more than 500 miles, on arrival you won't have to run to see a chiropractor. Just one last thing, this car gives strong emotions and is also very addictive, more you drive more you want to drive it.

 

It's a great car period. Power at your finger tips. Same with lusso. Own both. Great cars. Great daily drivers. Aka Grand tourer (GT).

 

Thanks all for your thoughts, I think this sounds like the right decision to switch. I'm aware of the multitude things you can do to soup up the 911, but the one thing you can't mod is the soul of the car. I'm in the early stages of research, but the color combo and spec on this F12 is more or less exactly what I'm looking for: https://www.ferrariofgreenwich.com/2017-ferrari-f12-berlinetta-c-2465.htm Any thoughts on whether this car is a good value at this price?

 

Well said Mario! I have tremendous respect for Porsche, but there is a difference and you summed it up nicely.

 

Not wanting to compare at all, but you can actually mod soul into a 991 turbo, dead serious. Do a track aligment wjth solid bushings, take those mufflers out for a kline, add the power and a brand new car will emerge. F12 is just a tonic of both drama and experience. Turbo will be mostly experience.
But you did the turbo, just try fezza land now.

 

I tell you what, if i didn't have to buy the FF for the 4 seater and loud v12, I will already have purchased this exact car, because I have actually been eyeing it for the past week since it was posted.

Assuming you like the combo, and blue that is as deep as Nero which means it's going to be a huge pita to maintain, and that there is no history with this car, I would buy it instantly (I love both blu pozzi and Blu scozia). The only question I would ask: how did this car end up in Greenwich?

 

Oh by the way, I had multiple Porsche gt3s and gt4, the sound and power of the flat 6 engines are not as good as the natural aspirated engines of Ferrari V8 and V12. You coming from a turbo s, you would not be looking back, trust me.

Please go buy that blu pozzi now so I can stop looking at it online all the time!

 

That car at Miller is gorgeous.

The comparison is a little unfair IMO as you are comparing a $200K car with another at $400K.

A question I have for the V12 crowd here is: if the V12's are so addictive to drive why are most cars for sale at ridiculously low mileage?

 

I own both a 991.1 GTS which I use as sort of an all-season daily (heavy winterstorms notwithstanding) and an F12. IMO, these cars are really meant for different purposes, so it's not like you can easily replace one with the other. F12 is a relatively big car with an extremely thirsty engine which is not that practical for intra-city slow speed driving from your home to your office and back. You can drive it to a date, an opera, an art auction - but driving it as you drive the 911 - every day and everywhere - defeats the purpose. Yes, you can, but no, you shouldn''t.

So if the 911 is your daily - keep it.

But also go for that F12. It is extremely well specced on the inside. The only thing you should check is whether you fit in those carbon fiber seats as they can be ordered to different size (S, M, L). Replacing the smaller or larger ones with such a level of interior trim could easily approach USD30-40k.

 

I put 5000 miles on my F12 so far this year! I don't know why people aren't driving them but most of the F12 owners I know are very busy people who often own a ton of cars but travel a lot etc.

 

I'll try to answer your question with my personal perspective.

There are a good number of owners who use their F12's as daily drivers but I’m convinced that the majority don’t drive their cars everyday. Despite of the fact that the F12 is a GT capable of being very civilised around town, it’s on the road that it performs the best driving experiences and shows some of it's potential. One of the reasons for the low mileage you see on the used F12’s for sale is the fact that many owners are very busy people and they don’t have the time to drive their cars as often as they would like. The F12 being a two-seater is also a car you not able to use in many occasions like for instance when you travel with your family. Another reason for modern two seater Ferraris not having an high milleage when they are put for sale is that psycological barrier of the 30.000 miles which normally can be an importante depreciation factor.
You’ll find very few ex or current owners that are critics of the F12 and the reasons for that are quite obvious. A superb power-train which enables anyone to enjoy great driving experiences , an unmistakeable and unique V12 sound that has no match and finally the acknowledge elegant and beautiful design of the last Ferrari carrying the Pininfarina label.

 

Doesn't explain the difference in mileage or use between the F12 and say a 458.

Many of the characteristics of F12 owners also apply to V8 owners: busy people, multiple cars, etc. Still does not explain why average mileage/use of V12's is much lower compared to the V8 cars.

Reason I'm so curious about it is I'm interested in the F12 myself.

 

I agree that this is likely why.

 

I actually drive the FF way more than the 458, but it's only because it's a 4 seater and very practical. Most people here have multiple F cars, maybe that is why. And not everyone drive their car as a DD, so I would not assume how good a car is based on the average mileage on the used market. Hope that makes sense.

 

+10000

 

Love the Pozzi blue at Miller also.

Taking the question a different way

To those with FF and F12 is the ride height much lower in the F12?

To me the idea that one could drive around town when not traveling argues for more miles versus a 458 as a daily. I find getting into and out of the FF easy and my 430( and I presume a 458 would be similar )harder due to its lower height. By comparison the Huracan is nearly on the floor.

So to me, the docile nature at lower speeds suggests the F12 would see more use.


It’s confusing to me.

 

Please see my add for my 2016' F12 with 1799 miles, never in the rain. Regards.