US 488 Pista Base and Options Pricing

I thought you ordered a Lusso to get your Pista, did that fall through? Not sure if the Pista will keep up with your 720S either.

If Speciale pricing can now be found below MSRP, one can only imagine what will happen to sky high Pista prices when the newer model comes out, but if you're worried about it you are in the wrong field.

 

that's the thing. It will be limited because of the price.

Not to mention that they have said total Pistas (assuming Spiders versions as well) are 3500 over 2 years. Note: it IS interesting that they the roofless version is called a Pista SPIDER vs Aperta. As others have noted perhaps the name 'Aperta' is reserved for the numbered cars and there are more versions of the Pista to be announced. Who knows.

The world of high-end products is fascinating from a marketing perspective

Example: Wife loves a certain brand of purses. She is on this brands VIP list so everytime they have an LE model she gets a personal invite to buy. Often before the purses are even announced to the public.

Sound familiar?

These purses ARE just cosmetic. They are literally made of the same material, same overall design. Cost, 2x the non-LE version. Maybe a different shade of trim here and there, but same product. Yet, they are LE and she could sell them post-sale and make a profit. (never does)

Same LE game is played in everything high end. Watches, Pens, designer fashion... it's all the same. Again, the big difference is that Ferrari actually has created something that is NOT just a limited run product with a slightly different design. Study the differences and you will realize that the Pista is basically a GTE race car. Ferrari said that the Pista has the most transference of race technology to a road car vs any of the previous lightweight versions of the mid-engined V8.

Ferrari is moving the game to the next level with the Pista. They have growing worldwide demand and are still limited in the number of cars they can sell. They will become MORE exclusive as the cars become harder to get. High-end consumers want exclusivity. That is part of the appeal. When something becomes too available the high-end consumer moves on. When Ferrari quotes anticipated production, track how many are projected to go to non-US markets. Hint: China.

 

I did order one and while waiting for my Lusso to go into build I thought better of it and pulled my Lusso order. The dealer can still get me a Pista but I have to wait a bit now which is fine by me. I dont need to be first.

From a performance perspective I bet they will be close but there is no denying how beautiful the Pista is. I love the 720, I cant find anything to replace it except the Pista. I will likely have the 750LT as well.

Speciale has done very well and I think it will retain its value better than the Pista for a number of reasons. The Pista will not be a collector car, I believe the Speciale will be over time just like the CS vs. Scud but to your point if that is the reason for the purchase then you should find something better to do with your money.

 

Regarding retention of value, the 720 does not stand a chance vs the pista.

Regarding performance, I can’t imagine the pista besting the 720. But for regular drivers like me, the difference is negligible.

 

This is too obvious to state and I doubt anyone had any misconceptions about this. I will say that regardless of how some feel on this forum about the 720 it is an incredible car.

 

Scuderia is a collectible car...really?

By what measures?
They are selling for under list and never exceeded list.
Example:
I bought our 09 Scud for $200k with 500 miles in 2011. Guy who sold it paid $305.
Car since increased in value from where I paid and is now in the low $200s.
Never exceeded the original price.
Desirable, sure. Collectible in the sense that it increases in value, nope.

Did the 360 CS..not so sure.

Assuming they will make 3500 Pista versions you are correct that is MORE than the Scud or CS. But, ask yourself what else is different? The sheer number of folks on the planet that want a Pista and can afford a Pista will keep it perhaps RARER than the Scuds and CS cars everywhere despite the potential increase in Pista production.

Here ya go:
Since 2009...

The number of millionaires in the world has increased by 155%, while the number of ultra high net worth individuals (defined in the report as people with a net worth above US $50 million) increased by 216%. Of the latter group, 51% reside in North America and 49% live somewhere else in the world, demonstrating that the U.S. continues to dominate in terms of the ultra wealthy. According to a forecast included in the report, the U.S. is expected to have the highest growth of millionaires – both standard and high net worth – in the world over the next five years.

How big? The number of U.S. households with a net worth of $1 million or more, not including the primary residence (NIPR), increased by 400,000 to reach a record 10.8 million in 2016.

In the U.S., there are 13.6 million people with $1 million or more in wealth, up 283,000 from the previous year. By the year 2021, the number of millionaires will reach 18 million – a 33% increase from current figures – and a number that is significantly higher than any other country. A different report on the same topic released by Spectrem Group in March 2017 suggests that the number of millionaires in the United States is even higher.

Credit Suisse also suggests that financial inequality in the U.S. is on the rise. Although the average wealth is $345,000 per person, the median wealth is only $30,000, marking a significant drop from last year and three times as low as other countries with similar average wealth.

Global Wealth
In the UK, over 406,000 people now find themselves outside of the millionaire’s club, after roughly US $1.5 trillion was wiped from the country's household wealth. The decline is largely blamed on the impact of Brexit. Overall global wealth has grown 5.2% annually in terms of USD since the year 2000 – representing only modest growth, according to the report. In dollar terms, wealth has grown by $139 trillion over the same period; by comparison, the estimated GDP of the entire world in 2015 is US $73.2 trillion.


Yes, the Scud was released in a bad economy. But it had a LONG time (10 years) to exceed its original price. Never has.

The Speciale has had the benefit of being an exceptional overall car based on the stunning 458. It ALSO had the benefit of a great global economy.

The Pista is better in every measurable way (except maybe sound) vs the Speciale. Most Pistas will be $400k plus. I know guys who have specced their cars to be around $500k. That will give a floor to the Speciale. Pistas will probably be the 'it' car for at least 24-36 months and stay strong for years just like the Speciale. There is nothing on the horizon that will take the throne from the Pista.

All bets are off if the wheels come off the economy in a meaningful way. Other than housing, the US economy is doing great.

 

sticker on my CS was 195k. i paid $140 in q3 2009. its worth more than 195k today.

i predict first time LE buyers who were excited to get a pista allocation will wake up with a bad taste in their mouth when they figure out the pista is going to be the first limited mid engine car to trade below par. not being invited to the part is sometimes better than being invited very late!

 

IMO the CS will further rise in value over time, it certainly wont lose. The Scud is a different story though. Great cars but not the same appeal.

 

Thank you for bringing facts to an internet discussion.

Due to the massive jump in price and no excuse like "last" NA V8, etc, wouldn't be surprised to see a drop in Pista values the moment the next 488 (or whatever it'll be called) is released. It'll be faster and nobody can knock it for lacking sound compared to its predecessor. Overall wealth is growing in the USA, but more and more people don't care for cars, especially those that live in major cities with higher income brackets. Friends of mine that are very similar in financial status can't justify the expense of a Ferrari, they like the car, but are just as happy in their Toyota.

An increase in production isn't all going to new markets, they have peaked for now and Argentina isn't looking to add many more.

 

I don't think thats entirely accurate. I think the 348 Serie Speciale went down. And I know the Scud went down. And now the Speciale is trading I think just below sticker- you know the last of the NA V8s that you can't lose with. Now its losing. And the CS - adjusted for inflation- is below par as well--- if you listen to the hype around the CS, this is a surprise. Especially if you look at the numbers made relative to the others. I know a guy who had a CS about 18 months ago and selling it for a big number was not as easy as we all thought it would be.

My opinion is all of these Special Series cars are collectible. However, I might define collectible a bit differently. My definition is I would want it in my collection.

When it's all said and done, I think the Pista will likely be about the same as these models. Also keep in mind the 3500 number is a guess. I think it will be lower than that. I have heard from people all over the world that demand is either "very strong" or "off the charts"....

 

I think the same percentage of people still enjoy cars. As a matter of fact, my experience is in the aggregate, more and more are enjoying these cars! How else do you explain the ever increasing sales at: Ferrari, Lamborghini, McLaren, Porsche, Aston-Martin, Bentley, Bugatti, Pagani, Rolls Royce, and then these really niche companies that are coming along.... when I was younger the market place could barely support Ferrari, Lamborghini and Porsche. Porsche nearly went under until they made a SUV. It seems to me, on real evidence, the market is strong. If you said you think the market is getting saturated, I would say it does feel a bit like that at times, but I don't really know the numbers.

 

The scud was launched during the end of the world.

Speciale was mass produced as well

348 - not sure what that is?!

Inflation isnt relevant - there hasnt been any in 20 yrs


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Go buy any car and dealers will tell you that demand is either "very strong" or "off the charts". Turn around and try to sell them back that same car and they will tell you the opposite. Never fall for dealer hype, classic BS marketing. Yes Pista demand is high, but supply will be relatively high too, along with a very high MSRP and more production than a Speciale (what was viewed as a Holy Grail). You really think Ferrari is going to put Pista production in the back seat and ramp up 488 GTB and Spiders? Nope. This is why truly limited production cars do astronomically better than "special" cars. Hang in there, be patient along with sufficient history, and a Pista will come your way towards the end.

 

All those super luxury brands were kept alive because they were under the umbrella of common car companies (VW, BMW, Fiat, etc), except for McLaren, but I believe they've had a large investor kick in some years ago to get them along for selling cars. Without them, they would've all gone under, especially during 2009.
Only way other car companies can increase sales is by introducing cheaper model, look at Mercedes and BMW, E class, S Class, 5 series and 7 series sales have all fallen off a cliff.

As you say, it took Porsche a SUV in order to stay alive.

 

Well, you know way more about that stuff, but according to the inflation calculator I just found, $195k in 2003 dollars would be $267k today. Maybe they are off a bit. I think there has been some inflation between then and now, even if slight. We could also play the same game with the Scud I guess.

https://www.usinflationcalculator.com

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari_348#348_Serie_Speciale

Btw- I agree with you about the Scud- but that kind of proves my point. Its trading about 16% down from its sticker price- but at much greater numbers than the CS. If you look at production numbers, and use the CS as the base line, you would think the Scud should be doing far worse today.

All these cars are so so special. We are living in a fortunate time.

 

Its been that way forever. There are 2 markets for newer production cars. The secondary market doesnt become real until 5 to 7 years after production end.


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I agree. I am going by various contacts around the world, some dealers, some people who are friends and substantial clients. I don't think the final production numbers of Pista will be meaningfully more than Speciale.

 

Just busting ur chops!!!! Anyone who owns a ferrari is fortunate and blessed! For me they got the 458 italia so right that its hard to get me excited with the newer stuff.


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That's true. But, yet, Bentley has been selling the CGT and variants since something like 03- thats 15 years of sales. They clearly thought enough of it to develop all those variants and the whole new model and so on. I am sure many of these cars get sold to people who buy one of each, but yet, there are more brands than ever, each with increasing sales. It sure is nice to have a big corporate sugar daddy to back you up. Thats for sure!

 

Will you start buying me cars????


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TOTALLY. They really nailed it. I think thats the best value out there right now.

 

For sure! Can’t complain if your driving any Ferrari.
Doing the OP, any idea on pricing, went overboard and loaded every carbon and option pretty much. Wanted to see if it’s $200k+ base? Was doing some quick math.

 

A lot of discussions on the number of Pista's to be produced. My dealer says Pista is a one year only production vs Speciale which was manufactured for two years. Now, this does not say the number of Pista's to be manufactured will be less than Speciale. The factory has enough capacity to make these cars; especially if 488 production will be limited in favor of Pista's. I don't think that happens though given the much higher price of Pista and therefore a more limited buyer pool. I have my Pista coming...

 

I enjoy this forum and seeing what are the situations around the world.

Now if your in the States as this blog is catered for US Pista options and pricing. Really are you going to gripe if they give you a spot and pay $400 - $500 k ? Poor old us it would be more likely $900 - $1million