125 points he's given up in 2017 and 2018. He's like Grosjean; hasn't learned a single thing from all this time in F1.
Seb is one helluva driver when he's at the front of the grid. Driving from behind has always been his Achille's heel. He knows that he can control the race once he gets to the front, but his race is controlled if not. That, imo, breeds his impatience and the rush to get to the head of the pack results in high-risk maneuvers. The team making mistakes only complicated things, as you've pointed out. I don't think Seb loses points for past performance. I just hope he can learn this year's lessons and improve because of them. No need for all of the Maldonado/Grosjean/Verstappen-like collisions.
Probably his years at Red Bull driving a faster car that allowed him to qualify at the front and run away from the opposition reduced his racecraft.
Well its funny as I started the thread. I'm not sure if I got the wording right or if there is any "right" way to look at the current level of disappointment. But we all seem to have a crystal ball knowing what is likely to occur each race. Ferrari is my one team and I will generally be rooting for their drivers and wish them well even after they leave. I still rooted for Massa, Alonso, Schumacher, etc. I would probably draw the line at Hamilton if for some reason they were to bring him on board... I'm not sure if I would root for Verstappen if he came on board either. With Vettel, I did not root for him at RedBull and really rooted for him and RedBull to lose. When he came on board at Ferrari, I thought that he would give them a great chance at another constructors and drivers championship so I said ok - for the Scuderia. But unfortunately, he. makes it hard for me to root for him (and the rest of the strategy team) because they can't seem to do some of the simple things. Vettel gets impatient and can't wait for the opportune moment to pass using his strengths, etc. We have covered all their issues here and in other threads. SO while I will always root for Ferrari, I have less to get excited about knowing what is likely to occur each and every race playing catch up. I feel pretty good about Kimi although he (with the strategists) is also hit and miss. Now with Leclerc coming on board, I get the feeling we will be in a rebuilding period again... until they figure out the car designs and rules changes for the next go... Then maybe in a few years we will finally have the upper hand. Ah - not easy being a Tifosi. Robb
Vettel, WDC or not has been exposed cleanly. 2 years in a row, very similar mistakes and at almost the same time with the same pressure points in the season. Consistent. His race craft is now required. He lacks it compared to drivers older and younger than him. I think we didn't see how evident that was when he faced Ricci. That was a bit 'telling' I think.
I've never been a great fan of Vettel, even when he was on the top, and being beaten by Ricciardo in 2014 was the confirmation I needed. But then I was pleasently surprised with his 2015 season: maybe not stellar but buite solid. Had he driven this year with the same regularity than in 2015, he still would be in the fight. The guy most probably is not a genius but can deliver. For some reason he's lost the plot. I hope he finds peace of mind again.
A question obvious being asked now about Vettel -http://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/24949412/how-sebastian-vettel-legacy-affected-2018
The news is more about Vettel/Ferrari possibly throwing the title away vs LH winning it - https://www.planetf1.com/news/briatore-questions-vettels-racing-attitude/
Why on earth would Hamilton want to drive for Ferrari when he beats them regularly with a Mercedes? I think that after the Alonso and Vettel shenanigans (so far) he knows all about the "prestige" of racing for the Scuderia !!!
Charles Leclerc will further expose Vettel next year. After that he will have to leave Ferrari And go into retirement because there will be nowhere else to go.
For the challenge... and because driving for and winning with Ferrari would make him even more immortal. Indeed it indeed path rife will danger and these are particularly dangerous times at Ferrari with the leadership in flux. The genius of Michael was that he went there as part of a unit (w/Ross and Rory)...each having each others backs, 100% confidence in one another, and the time to execute their plan. It would be the equivalent of Lewis going to Ferrari with Toto Wolff and James Allison/Aldo Costa (which is obviously not going to happen)
First of all, I don't believe in that axiom that "driving for and winning with Ferrari would make him even more immortal". For me that is complete BS. As for a challenge, don't make me laugh. The role of a driver is to find the best team possible, and win with it. Ferrari isn't that team now. Ferrari is behind Mercedes and Red Bull in terms of design, organisation and strategy It's also too divided, with too many intrigues, a high turn-over of technical staff, etc .... it's a toxic environment. You can say what you want about Hamilton, but he isn't stupid
No, imo, that it's absolutely true and unquestionably so. Even Ferrari drivers who have flamed out will always be Ferrari drivers. See Michael Schumacher...he could easily stayed at Benetton and could have won Championships in 1996/97 but he knew the challenge and potential rewards of being part of reversing the fortunes of the Scuderia would be far, far greater...and he was absolutely correct. Winning is always sweeter when it is hard...and I think Lewis genuinely relished the tough fight with Ferrari in the 1st half of the season (as he himself said many times.) Exactly - which is why it would be silly to go there now as a single entity, without powerful, loyal allies in high places...
And as I am frustrated with Ferrari’s current abilities and shortfalls, I can relax that we are at least not the debacle that is McLaren. Robb
Why on earth would Michael Schumacher want to driver for Ferrari when he beats them regularly with a Benetton? Some people want a new challenge. Hamilton isn't really a team builder though, more of a team jumper like Senna was so I can't see him taking it on.
That's because you are not a fan of Ferrari and are, in fact, a hater and actively root for them to fail. Any time the team is facing a difficult time you are always there, latched on in every thread, posting up a storm. You love it. To dismiss driving for Ferrari as no big deal is absurd. Their legend is huge and it is still the most coveted seat on the grid. All the drivers know this.
Of course Lewis isn't a team builder. No driver is hired to do that. Team management is responsible for hiring/building the team.
Tell that to Schumacher. People joined because he was there, and he knew everyone’s names and birthdays. He was a one-off, and Elton isn’t fit to lick his boots Elton has never been on the radar of ferrari, both the team and he himself have said so, so stop with the Elton to ferrari crap, we don’t want him Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Some people have the ability to do so. Very few. Michael Schumacher did. He never goes to Ferrari, Ferrari doesn't win jack in the 90s and 2000s. It's that simple. Lewis is more like Senna in that he would run over his grandmother to get the best car. Even though McLaren gave him his start (in a WDC capable car as a rookie - unheard of) and was very fast from 2010-12 he was actively lobbying Red Bull to take him on. Then he jumped to Merc based on Lauda and Toto's promises of their super engine. It was a good move, but he didn't build it. Look at this year, Lewis is so spoiled is unreal. He thought Ferrari was getting faster there for a couple races (reality now tells us otherwise), and the whining from him about their super secret tricks was hilarious. As Christrian Horner said, "let me get out my smallest of violins for Lewis." Extra funny when you realize he has driven better cars than anyone in F1 history. Would like him to endure some character building years like Alonso has had to put up with. I suspect it would get pouty and REAL ugly real fast.
