Sebastian Vettel

Vettel took a car that was in a completely different class and stayed in the lead for 4 championship years. Maybe he didn't learn a whole lot of racecraft being ahead of the entire field for the majority of Red Bull's dominant years.

If you give Vettel credit for being a 4-time champion, you also have to give Lewis credit for his 5-time championship status. Both men were smart enough to put their butts in the right seat at the right time. Maybe that is what F1 has become? 10 great drivers trying to end up in the right seat with the right team at the right time, so they can rack up the championships.

 

Apart from the fact that the RB was far less in a different class than the Mercedes in the first 4 years of the hybrid era (just watch 2012 when the first 7 races were won by 7 different drivers) I tend to agree with you... But whereas it seems to be "common sense" over here that the RB was the driving force behind Sebs WDCs one is called "hater" "dismissing the achievements of Lewis" if one says the same about him....Why is that???

 

It’s also really weird when one of their arguments when someone says anything about Elton is ‘well, Vettel is ......blah blah blah’, yet no one here ever lauds Vettel as the definitive driver of the last ten years..... its playground tit for tat because they know their argument is based on dodgy ground

 

But we all have to agree that right now, at this point in time, Vettel does suck. That’s a fact. Sadly.

 

I woke up everybody at home with the profanity I shouted when he spun again this past weekend.

I got a reprimand and more points deleted from my license. Another one and I'll be banned from watching F1.

 

Certainly not easy to assess but this year he has poor decision matrix and weak race-craft given his record of the past. He does not appear as a savvy driver. Impatient poorly planned or impulsive moves with bad timing. Now a consistent over 2 years as a distinct trend. A 4 time WDC????

 

Please do not emulate Vettel in front of the children. Manners please

 

Ross about Vettel—

"It was another lost opportunity to close the gap in the title fight, especially when we saw what [race winner Kimi] Raikkonen did with the same car.

"I certainly don't want to put Vettel in the dock, but these incidents can no longer be seen as coincidence.
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/139589/brawn-vettel-incidents-show-he-out-of-sorts

 

This and last season have only proven out my long belief that Vettel is overrated and capable of winning only when starting at the front in clear air driving a superior car.

He is unequivocally NOT the second coming of Schumacher.

 

Hamilton should be fairly busy with LeClerc and Max next year, but only if the Ferrari and Honda engines are competitive

 

Add Vettel to the busy pile. Max, Charles n LH will be keeping him busy potentially!

 

Missing the comfort of Horner does he lol --
Sebastian Vettel does not appear to be as "happy" at Ferrari than at former team Red Bull, says says former F1 driver David Coulthard. The German has been seen "around Red Bull more often in the last few races than at any other time that he's been at Ferrari", says Coulthard. (GP Fans, via Channel 4)

 

10 great drivers battling over 3.5 great cars.
It's more like a lottery than a championship.

 

Hey, I love the car, Not the driver. You do good, your the man, You do bad, you gotta go! NEXT!

 

http://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/25071894/is-ferrari-getting-rid-wrong-driver-end-year

Sebastian Vettel made another mistake in Austin, while Kimi Raikkonen converted the pace of the car into a very overdue victory. Is Ferrari replacing the wrong driver next year?

NS: Raikkonen has been performing well this year but if one of them had to make way for Charles Leclerc, it has to be him. A more interesting question is whether Vettel will handle the pressure of Leclerc next season.

MH: I think it's easy to ask that question on the basis of what we saw on Sunday. If only Kimi could do that every time. He's the perfect Number 2. Given the choice, I don't think he could be bothered leading the team if he had Leclerc as team-mate. At 39, going on 40, Kimi is not the future for Ferrari. Even allowing for Vettel's increasing number of mistakes under pressure, he's their best bet -- for now.

KW: I don't know if they're replacing the wrong driver -- I think Kimi has had his fill of life as a Ferrari driver and is looking forward to the Sauber adventure to come -- but I do think that Seb is not proving himself worthy of his massive salary this season. If teams pay their drivers win bonuses, why can't they tax them for screwing up? In terms of lost championship points and car repairs, Sebastian Vettel has been a $30 million man in addition to his salary. Seems fair that Ferrari should be able to claim a bit of that back, or negotiate a lower deal for next year.

LE: I don't think keeping Raikkonen would be the solution to Ferrari's problems -- one look at the drivers' championship will tell you that -- but perhaps they are regretting signing such a long contract with Vettel. When you consider that Daniel Ricciardo, Max Verstappen and even Fernando Alonso would all jump at the chance to be the No.1 driver at the Scuderia, Vettel's current form looks even worse.

 

There were better places to pass Seb - https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11533267/mexican-gp-sebastian-vettel-rues-costly-spins-in-title-race

Sebastian Vettel has rued his damaging spate of in-race spins but says those incidents have not been the result of taking too many risks.

Vettel's attempts to beat Lewis Hamilton to this year's world title could officially end in Sunday's Mexican GP with the Ferrari driver's challenge heavily compromised by three spins in the last five races.

"If you are the one spinning then obviously something didn't go right," conceded Vettel


"Obviously inside the car it always looks a little bit different than you look from 13 different angles and in slow motion and so on and, by that time, even the last person in the paddock might have an opinion. So it's obviously different but every opinion might differ.

How Hamilton can win the title in Mexico

"The main thing is that fundamentally I didn't try to do anything silly or anything stupid. I wasn't hard-headed trying to do something that would never work.

"Obviously now it's happened a couple of times too much. Next time there will be a gap I'm sure I will go for a gap but, surely, it's in the back of your head trying to keep the car facing the right direction."

 

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ricciardo-defends-vettel-driving-erratic/3202197/?nrt=54

I leave this to the one who think "he is done" or lucked into winning a WDC....

 

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.perez-leads-defence-of-vettel-after-title-challenge-slips.4e9DPmif8QwmWMMeWO6oUK.html
Same and some more...

 

Vettel has chosen to take the matter is his own hands and is trying too hard and it is easy to criticize from the sidelines , you are a hero if it works and a zero if it fails . His support cast is not fairing too well at the present and the modern F1 cars are not very forgiving if driven over the limit . We should cut him some slack , he will be back , you don't become 4 time WDC being useless .

 

Ross Brawn's opinion concern me more than the drivers commenting. Driver's tend to self support as a group. Privately they would think Vettel needs to make better decisions. Thats the obvious concern. Winning on lap 1 is never a good long term strategy and they all know it.

 

Question is whether Ross has the insight in the teams at the moment?
It is funny that one time one has to trust the opinion of the drivers (see f.e. the thread of Hamilton) and then not because they are biased
So apparently one can choose whatever suits, there is plenty to choose from like in media (aka "fake news"). At the end of the day we are all right because we all can back it up with trustworthy opinons from insiders

 

Based on his performance in Germany, I'm not even so sure of that.

 

Vettel will either get better or get worse and even he doesn't know which way his career will go. Some drivers show great early promise but then fall back and swirl around mid pack for however long they can take it. For a few years Hulkenburg looked like a comer, now he's just a good driver in a so-so team. Massa, Baricello, Irving, Mancel, Rosberg (both of them), Jack and Gil V, almost all the number twos and most of the number ones have short moments of glory and years of close but no cigar. Does anyone believe that Bottas or Ricardo or any of the best of the rest drivers will ever become WDC? Leclerc is a shiny penny but he could become yesterday's news very fast. Even Max could make one dumb decision and be stuck in a losing car for just enough years to leave him behind. So back to Vettel. And Hamilton. It takes a lot of heart to go through years of almost but not quite. Vettel after four quick championships at RB, seems to be tiring of the fight at Ferrari. If he doesn't win next year I think he'll retire. His only other choice is to become a has been like Alonzo and Kimi. Hamilton is the best driver on the grid today. He went from young star to years of real struggle. But he had the stuff inside to never give up. Now he is at the top of his form and in a team that gives him everything he needs. Overwhelming odds that he wins his 5 WDC this weekend. But if he wakes up Monday and suddenly feels he has nothing left to prove...or if the 2019 Mercedes is a disaster...then his career could also be quickly over. I don't think we'll see another Michael Schumacher because I'm not convinced the sport has that many years left. I like Vettel a lot. But he'll never be close to a GOAT.

 

If the Mercedes had not become the dominant all conquering car it did in 2014, and stayed as such (including this year where Mercedes have politically destroyed Ferrari’s best chances at a car that could beat them, and cheated themselves back to the front before ‘declaring’ their cheat so it could be banned but no sanctions given), then Elton would have retired a long time ago. At McLaren he was abysmal from 2009 onwards, and was doing the exact same thing Vettel is today, overdriving and having crashes and spins......... he is not the best driver on the grid, he is one of them. Alonso is THE best driver, without doubt and acknowledged by every team principle in the sport... he doesn’t get driver of the year and stuff because his car is not competitive, it’s only given to the title protagonists.

Put Elton in vettels cars for the last five years, Vettel is 9 times world champion, simple as that.

 

+1 and other drivers would be capable as well in the Mercedes. LH has simply made less mistakes when it counted. The differences are fine between the top drivers but discernable. Vettel is the most notable disappointment this year. Bottas as well but he has had some bad luck that have cost him 2-3 wins.

It would not surprise me if we hear rumor and soon, of Vettel looking to go back to Red Bull. Why not its F1 and all is possible.