Miura, the original supercar

Dear Olivier,

you wrote :

Frankly, I brought another Miura which was burnt and is under rebuilt by Polo Storico… it arrived with : engine is original and few body & frame items allowing to identifying its Bertone stamps… but overall the car represented xx% of the real one, so it was eligible for restoration.

Is it possible, that it is the burned Miura from the Gombert Collection ?

http://www.osenat.com/lot/79376/6485773

Best regards

Zdenek

 

IMO we all spend already too much time with this topic. To make this short:

It´s clearly a non-original Miura which will be restored by Lamborghini factory (Polo Storico) and their sub-suppliers to non-original spec. With this procedure, Lamborghini especially Polo Storico will lose reputation in many ways – also in terms of value of a PS certification for collectors. How can Polo Storico certify a Lamborghini in terms of originality if they even restore cars to wrong spec?!

I really hoped they learn time by time, but it seems it’s a long process and they first need to suffer and learn maybe after that…

Another topic, I found time to make photos of my original 400GT/Islero air filter covers. Joe might be right, it was original more brighter and faded because of heat, dirt, oil fume.


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The information regarding the Miura #4088 SJ, SVJ or Jota recreation or whatever it is and the association with Patrick Mimran is not true. He said yesterday that he does not remember anything about it, he never owned it and he did not have it rebuilt for his own use. It doesn't sound like he was into cars from the past at all having said that he has always lived in the present which is why at that time he owned a Countach. Then from this very same Miura #4088 Mimran story that it was converted by the factory is very probably not true either and I'm sure Mimran would have remembered something about this car. The modifications to this car are not like on any of the other SV based factory SVJs either. I think if Mimran had really wanted an SVJ copy he'd have had one based on an SV not an S anyway. I have asked Patrick if it was his brother Jean Claude who had 4088 converted by the factory for his own use but I have not received a reply yet but I'm sure if Jean Claude owned this car Patrick would have remembered it.

 

Miura #4088, is well documented in Books with Pictures showing the afterworks building the car for Patrick.
http://www.lambocars.com/miura/miura_svj_and_customized_miura.html

http://www.lambocars.com/images/miura/all/miura_svj29.html
http://www.lambocars.com/images/miura/all/miura_svj45.html

I don't know what you guys smoke, but obviously it has some effects, please calm down.

 

You should submit an application form for "head of Polo Storico" you have your chance...

 

All these comments about #4808 and #4088 are only suppositions, hypotheses, allegations, theories, you can believe in that ... in fact there is nothing concrete and relevant, just the pleasure of denigrating these cars because it does not enter into your criterias ... or because you believe to have all answers or because Patrick Mimran doesn't remember thus it is the truth... as Raymond wrote : stop smoking guys.

The difference of opinion is one thing, however you can insufflate or wait on how the factory should behave as you wish and/or when it may suit you is not very serious.at all.

If factory decides of rules, you just complies end of story.

If you disagree, then you go your way, but don't decribidilise if you disagree.


Who are we to tell which way the factory must go to ? Joe ? Leo ? Stephen ? Please let's have a little humility overhere, and keep going with other topics.

 

This is correct, #4710

 

I'll take the direct word from the man himself over what is stated about him in books and on line articles thanks.

 

4088 was in Patrick's posession until they sold almost the whole Mimran car collection in the brooks auction in Geneva, that's simply a fact, as well as it was modified in the riparto assistenza, well after the white giant #4808 got displayed at Auto Salon 1981, perhaps Patrick got influenced by 4808.
I don't know, newer asked him and honestly I don't care either, funny coinicident, just turn two letter of the vin 4088 <-> 4808.

 

Was the Mimran collection of cars documented on line anywhere or in an auction catalogue?

Although I had sent a picture of the orange 4088, I thought Patrick may have been confused by the similarity of the chassis numbers, which is why yesterday I asked him separately that I was enquiring about a different car, 4088 and not 4808 as I was asking about previously. A number of articles state 4088 was rebuilt as an SVJ replica for Patrick's brother Jean Claude, so I asked if it belonged to him after Patrick said he knew nothing about it and never owned it etc. I think it is quite significant that he said he has always lived in the present so he had a Countach which was in the present at that time. I don't know if he will reply.

 

Thanks for the photos. As I suspected the "BO OO88" screen printing on the top of the air cleaner covers is not correct for the early Miura. Is this right? The original early Miura ones I have seen, especially for the P400 car, all have "BOX 0138" as the sequence at the bottom. Can anyone confirm this?

 

Olivier, as you and some people know, but as many on this wonderful forum do not know, because it is not advertised, Polo Storico does not have its own restoration facilities. All of the actual restoration work is outsourced, and none of it is done at the factory. Polo Storico is merely an office, warehouse, restoration advisor, certifier and access point to original factory records and (some) parts. Nothing more, nothing less. As such, can you share which shop Polo Storico outsourced the work of rebuilding 4710 to?

 

It has been mentionned several time in this Forum that polo Storico has contractors, but I have no pic to document you on that car... but Marchesi did the frame... William the electricity.... etc...

 

Thank you, Olivier.

 

2 weeks ago I visited the Kunstpalast ("Art Palace") here in Düsseldorf, Germany to see the exhibition "PS-Ich Liebe Dich" ("PS-I Love You" / PS stands for horse power) about car design from the 1950-70s. Very nice show in a spectacular setting.
Most spectacular are two Miura in the same gold color on each side of the main entrance! Don`t ask me for the VIN of the "opened" car - its VIN was overtaped...
(sorry for the lousy pics from my iPhone...)
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I found this on the net which does confirm 4088 was in the Mimran collection at the Sotheby's Geneva September, 1997 sale.

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^^^ Does anyone have the above catalogue who would be kind enough to post a copy or email me the description of #4088 at the Sotheby's 1997 Geneva sale? Many thanks in advance.

 

Series 1 P400's have BO 0088, series 2 P400's have BO 0138. So it depends on your on your definition of an early P400.

Cheers Jim

 

At which car did the series 1 P400 end and series 2 begin? Is this defined by the thin-gauge earlier cars (1-126) vs 1mm cars (127 on)?

 

That is the guideline I use, there where a lot of minor changes made when that change occurred.

Cheers Jim

 

Jim, 3216, a known original car, is #84, a series 1 thin-chassis car. Its air cleaner covers are BOX 0138's. Are you sure it's not the other way around? Series one having 0138's, and series two and the rest having 0088's? I have seen a few SV's with 0088's as well (but they were restored cars so who knows).

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If they would pay me enough money, why not?! I am very confident a young, motivated person who has an eye for details can bring some benefits in the process.

 

I think on this topic there is no 100% correct answer. Sure is #4904, a very original example of a Miura SV has "BOX 0138" on the covers.

Does anyone know what BOX 0088 or 0138 means? As far as i know, all air filter and air filter housing covers on 350/400/Islero/Espada/Jarama/ Miura are identical, just the housings itself are different in several ways.

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