348 TB whining sound

I see you are in Fla. Many cars like yours there. You need to listen to one to know if your noise is abnormal. You have a sensitive ear. Describing the sound is getting you nowhere.

 

It would be great if I could listen to somebodys car. I have been building engines and tuning cars for years so I do have a ear for noise. Some tech friends of mine think Im a little crazy and there is nothing wrong but they do not have the expierence I do when it comes to engines. Ive torn down motors for what they call mechanical noise only to find a main bearing installed upside down (no oil) allowing the crankshaft to make noise. Im just really picky I guess.

any takers on me being able to listen to thier cars?

 

Florida is a big state. Where are you located? I'm in East Central Florida, on the coast.

 

Sorry, Im in Daytona beach

 

Cool. I'm a short hop 1.5 hours south on I-95 / US1 if you want to come listen to mine. My personal email is webmaster AT wsra DOT com. Email me and we can set something up.

I wouldn't consider myself an expert (stooge), but I've had the car for 7 years and done most of my own work, so I'm pretty familiar with their quirks by now.

 

Well after a short trip to" whyte" (thanks for the invite, good people there) I had a listen to his car. His car does have a similar sound from the timing belt area but I left still a little puzzled. His car has the plastic timing cover and mine is aluminum. I think this may be the difference in tone and how loud the sound is.

Can anyone confirm if the sounds from each timing cover differ a slight bit? I would assume that each material would absorb sound differently.

thanks

 

Nice to meet you too. Cute kid also.

Glad to meet another DIYer in the area. I'm looking forward to some weekends wrenching in the future.

 

I also had a whine/squeal noise - it was very odd, from inside the cockpit it sounded like it was directly behind the firewall so naturally assumed alternator belt (cambelt just changed with Hills tensioners and new waterpump). Anyhow, to cut a long story short it ended up being the clutch release bearing. Once inside the pumpkin, they also found:

Twin plate clutch worn to the rivets.
Shaft seals leaking.
Flywheel and rear clutch plate contaminated with gearbox oil.

So I am having the upgraded Hills release bearing and a new twin plate clutch and new oil seals for the shaft.

Really odd though because I was 99% sure it was coming from just behind the firewall!
Pictures below of front and rear clutch plates:
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Mine you can hear from inside the engine bay also right at the timing cover. Im starting to believe it is just normal. Ive found a video on youtube, "348 engine dyno" or something like that. The sound of the whine is just like the whine on that video. I know a recorded sound is not comparable but from my computer it is the same as my car. It could be the echo of the exhuast on the video for all I know, but the sound my speakers are making on my desk are the same sound my timing belt makes.

My noise dosnt change at all via depressing the clutch. It is all in the timing belt area for sure. This is why Im wondering what the sound difference is between the aluminum one and the plastic timing covers. I just need to listen to a car with the same cover I guess.

The motor is coming out after the summer for the belt service, I just want to make sure it will last that long. Id hate to tear it down just before the weather gets nice.

 

Vbturbo2

Wanted to know if you ever got to the bottom of this? My 348 has started to make the same whine after a belt service.

Thanks

 

Is this the wine your referring too? You can hear it in the video when he pulls away and in the car. If so maybe people can comment if not then maybe post a clip. This may help if you specify if it does it when you rev the motor out of gear or just when moving in gear?

Mine sounds exactly like the video (stock cats and exhaust as well) for reference. I never owned it before a full service though so can't say what it was like before. Sounds like gear wine to me since its the same inside and out as opposed to exhaust sound.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/ferrari-348ts-video-of-some-hard-pulls-exhaust-sound.590510/

 

That car sounds like it has issue in gearbox. I personally would check ringnuts asap


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The aluminium covers are on early cars, the plastic on later ones.

Interestingly, the bearing originally used was superceded by a different one due to noise issuses.

I may be wrong but I think it's item 11 on thediagram below; part no. 170787 supercedes 144690

https://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari/348-1993-tb-ts/engine/timing-controls-23636

Item 12 on this list and IIRC it gets a mention in the factory repair manual

 

Yes that bearing was a roller bearing and was failure prone there was a TB to replace it with a ball bearing. Roller bearings tend to wine. When in there there is also a Hill timing cover bearing in front of it that should be replaced.

 

I posted ab out this a while back but got no answer, do you just remove the side covers and check the stake nut or is there more to inspecting that? Is there anything spring loaded or anything behind the ring nut cover? I assume you can check it with oil in the GB? If there was a post of checking it can you link it.

 

Maybe because there's no simple answer? I just added some links to your thread.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/checking-ringnut-stake-question.587439/

 

Hi there

The whining sound is there even if the car is out of gear and in neutral. The sound is similar to the car in the video but it is always hard to confirm on a recording. I tried removing the alternator and ac belts but that didn't make a different either. I'm now dropping the engine out and will check the timing belt and adjuster bearing.

Thanks

 

If you can post a souns clip then do so, it may help someone else. Even a drive away like the other video i linked to. keep us updated as well.

 

I couldn't post any sound clips as I'd already had the engine dropped out of the car. However there were two things we found. One the belt was very loose!! Also there was a lot of marks on the outside of the belt, seemingly caused by the small guides placed near the cams. I've attached pictures and you can see where the belt has rubbed up against these. Should these guides be actually touching the belt? If not how much gap should exist between the belt and the guides? Also is there any procedure for how tight the belt should be?

Thanks

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No.
The guides/shoes should not be touching the belt. They are there to help prevent the belt from jumping a tooth, due to belt slap.

When I installed the guides/shoes on my F119 I left a 1mm gap, or basically the width of a match book cover folded over, between the shoe and the belt.

I install the timing belt and let the tensioner do all the work. Trust me the spring puts a lot of tension on the belt. I will rotate the engine over by hand at least 3 times. Then I will slowly rotate the engine until I do not see the tensioner move anymore, then lock down the retaining bolt.
The shop manual says to use a tenioner gage to measure the tension on the belt. I haven’t ever used the gage but many others have.

 

Mine was similar... the shoe or shoes riding the belt.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/348-show-us-your-belts-and-bearings.523610

 

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if they were installed the way you're holding it, that's backwards. the shoe goes upward.

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sjd

 

it's an easy mistake to make.



sjd

 

Here are a couple of pics of how I installed the followers/guides/shoes. Again about 1mm of space is what I use, and the foot of the shoe faces up. Those are little strips I cut from a drink coaster.
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I did the same thing as Ernie