shifting times in 360 and f430

how laggy is the shift in 360 vs f430? I know scuderia is the fastest here. seeing the 360 videos it seems like theres almost a third to half a second lag? what about the F430?

i know its never going to be as fast as a scuderia or 458 but curious what the lag times are like on the 360 and F430.

In my mind 360 should be slower. Also the premiums on manual F430 seems quite pronounced. If the F1 is too laggy on the 360 then might as well buy the manual 360 is what I'm thinking.

 

Good luck on shifting manually in 150 ms like the 360 does in Sport at high revs. Nothing laggy about that.

 

Remember, they measured from power to power, not the time to move the lever.

 

The 430 was an evolution and obviously an improvement.

If this is more on the lines of 'why is my 360 shift a bit crap'....then the answers are....

1. Thrust bearing is leaking (so clutch will be worn/burnt)
2. EV0 is leaking
3. Something is leaking / worn / bent / broken.
4. Update TCU firmware to a late Modena (speak to Eric)


Once done, the 360 shift with plenty throttle applied is a wonderful thing, the brutality of it makes it special.

 

its actually the 360's low rev's shift speed that bothers me. Really bothers me. Driving a real sequential (race car), even 3000rpm will shift faster than a scuderia 7000rpm shift. After accustomed to that, everything shifts slow..... sigh, human satisfaction is so unforgiving

 

Shift lag in a 360 is very much affected by the TCU you have. My '03 shifts are incredible. Hard and fast in sport mode when applying plenty of throttle.
After driving plenty of stick shift 911s (and one on the track) I can't say I'd ever go back to a rowing through the gears... especially in a 360 with the long throws and that old timey gated shifter.

 

Best thing I did was the cs tcu upgrade from Eric.i have one complaint for the 360 its first gear from a stop other then that I love the car. I attached a video shifting at high rpms.




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does the CS have same shift time as 430? what does the 360 TCU do? does it get the 360 CS shift times?

 

There are various "generations" of TCUs within each model. The below list is not all encompassing, but gives you the general cut offs that are often referred to:
Early 360
Late 360 (mid 2003 to 2005?)
CS
Early 430
Late 430 (mid 2008 to 2009) (this was in conjunction with transmission change which negate upgrading an early 430 to later 430 shift times)
430 Scuderia (this was in conjunction with transmission changes, which negates "upgrading" an early 430 to Scuderia shift times)

My understanding is any 360 can be upgraded via a later TCU, versus 430s are basically stuck with what they came with.

 

so when one updates a 360 tcu what level of speed shifting does it achieve? that of the CS?

 

If you install a CS TCU, I believe so.

 

If you have the CS TCU with upgraded CS ECU maps, you have a wonderful thing of beauty...

I had the CS TCU previously but recently had the ECU maps done too. Tremendous!


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I am sure my cat like reflex's are at LEAST 75ms or less in my gated 360

 

wld be good to have confirmed numbers....i think the CS and 430 are the same. i have an 06 430 and late 07 430 and i cant feel the difference between the 2 even though the late o7 is supposed to have improved shifting times. i also have a CS and the CS and the 430 sort of feel the same, seat of the pants. my regular 360 def felt slower shifting than 430 and CS.

 

Based on memory....left Maranello many years ago...

F430 130 millisecond
612 Scaglietti 130 millisecond
599 100 millisecond
Scuderia 60 millisecond

 

Is the cs 100 or 130?


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No way it is 100. It is basically the same system as the 360, just different programming. The 599 is completely different system.

 

The number quoted by Ferrari for the CS is 150 ms. Same for early F430s, but later ones were upgraded and quicker. Someone here had the times for the late F430, but I forgot to write them down.

Depending on equipment, the 612 shifts in 180 ms, 160 ms (HGTS/HGTC), 125 ms (late 2007 upgrade for all 612s), or 100 ms (OTO/Sessanta with Superfast I).

575M 220 ms, 180 ms (HGTC and Superamerica)

599 100 ms, 85 ms (HGTE), 60 ms (GTO with Superfast II)

Scuderia/16M 60 ms with Superfast II

 

These shift times are all objectively pretty fast- as Taz points out, they’re all faster than a human will reasonably shift 90+% of the time. The problem is there’s a difference between what is objectively fast, and what feels fast. 100-200ms can feel like a long time whilst you “wait” for the gear to change. You’re “busy” the whole time you shift manually, so the perception is that it’s faster.

The other thing to remember is that the time’s quoted above are the fastest shifts; during most driving, the ecu will select a more relaxed program.


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Affirmative, min shift times are in Sport/Race depending on model, pretty much at wide open throttle, and at high revs.

 

what does upgrading a TCU cost for 360?

 

need to scan the previous threads on the subject. Later cars can remove and send the TCU out to be reflashed. Early cars need at least a later TCU to reflash. All cars can be updated by simply buying a CS TCU outright, but not sure they are still being made. All will require some programming and set up to work correctly once plugged into the car.

 

Contact eric355. He can give you info on flashing your TCU (if not an early car) or buying a flashed CS TCU. I have an early model 360, so bought a CS TCU from him. My car is currently undergoing manual conversion, and I will have my flashed CS TCU for sale in the near future.

Kevin