599 GTB and 458 Speciale rims

Hello

I think about the 458 Special rims on my 599 GTB.
Width and offset would work.

Original Challenge rims
8x20 offset 43,5 = 58,1 mm from hub to outside (+22 mm spacers = 80,1 mm)
11x20 offset 63,8 = 75,9 mm from hub to outside (+25 mm spacers = 100,9 mm)

9x20 offset 44,7 = 69,6 mm from hub to outside
11x20 offset 48,4 = 91,3 mm from hub to outside

At the moment I have 255/35 and 315/35
So 458 Special would work with these or the GTO sizes


But I saw, that the rear 458 Special rim has a max load of 4446 N, about 450 Kg per rim
I don't know the max load of the front rim.

The Speciale has a weight of about 1290 Kg
The 599 GTB has a weight of about 1685 Kg
Front/rear weight is about 40/60% (I don't know exactly) so you have about 500 Kg for each rear wheel.

Too much ???

Daniel

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Daniel- Weight distribution is way closer to 50/50 on the 599 than 40/60, which is more like a mid-engine car.

 

Terry, you are right

I found 48% front - 52% rear

With 1700 Kg you get about 425 Kg per rim
But this is static and theory

With 2 Persons and driving you will get more load on each rim.

Would this be a problem ?

Daniel

 

Daniel- I would think so. Newtons do not directly translate into kgs of weight, but kg-f or kilograms of force. It is a force measurement instead of a weight measurement. One newton is the force required to accelerate one kg one meter/second/second. 4446 N is a huge force a 599 will not pump into a wheel.

 

Terry, i was sure that you, with your aircraft knowledge, can explain this for better understanding.

Watched some more rims, all from the USA
Vossen has some very very nice variants.
Also ADV1 and HRE.

But going with larger wheels, I don't know.
And more than 8000 $ for nearly original sizes, I don't know.

Saw a GTO conversion with the F12 TDF rims, looks nice too.

But the Speciale rims, they fit well and you see much of the brakes.

Have to think about.

Thanks a lot, Daniel

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I have a bit of an old fashioned view on changing out wheels. My personal view is that the wheels define how the car was when it was in period and would have been a careful design choice, so I rarely do I think changing them is a good thing. That's not to say a 458 or F12 wheel isn't a thing of beauty - just a thing of beauty on a F12 or a 458. I feel much the same way about aftermarket hifi/stereos.

I'd love to put an F12 style horizontal trunk lid tricolore on mine, near the Ferrari badge, but can't bring myself to do it.

Overriding rule is... your car, so you be you.

 

I am the same way. Generally not a fan of wheel swaps. BUT I do like the Special wheels on the 599 in the OP; it is one of the few times I have liked a swap. They remind me of the HGTE wheels and I do like those a lot.

 

Daniel- Personally, I think the Speciale wheels look great, but my choice (if I had a 599), would be 599 GTO wheels. These show up at reasonable prices occasionally.

 

The guy who wanted to sell these nearly new 458 Speciale rims for 3000 €, had no chance to legitimate them on a 458 Spider, because the weight of the Spider is to high for the rims.

458 Speciale rims
Front : 3451 N
Rear : 4446 N

weight (empty)
458 Speciale : 1290 Kg
458 Spider : 1535 Kg
599 GTB : 1685 Kg

The 599 GTB has max load front 900 Kg and rear 1100 Kg, max 2000 Kg in total.

So I decided not to go with these rims.
Let's see what I will do.

Daniel

 

I don't believe that the extra 245 Kg would cause any problem with the rims. There is no way Ferrari designed that close to the limit. BUT your laws may not allow it; I know your laws are more strict in this way than they are in the US.

 

Hi John

Believe me, it was a hard decision.


Perhaps these Speciale rims have reserves in stress, but perhaps not as much as the 599 would need.
Who knows.
If I had the 458 Spider datas, I would have bought them.

1999 i bought my Maserati Ghibli in Milano Italy.
The car was modified in some details to Ghibli Open Cup : suspension, 8,5 and 9,5x18 inch rims, ....
I drove home the 350 km.
When I was at home, I had a rear tire damage, my luck that nothing happened.
After I removed all the rims, I found cracks in the inside area of the rim, where the tyre lost pressure.
1 front rim was OK
1 front rim had 4 cracks
both rear rims had 12 and 14 cracks

So I'm a little bit biassed in that case.
And correct, law here is strict, but that was not the problem.




Updates will follow

Daniel

 

Ordered a set of new 599 GTO rims in corsa grey.

Terry was right, best choice for the 599 GTB.

Daniel

 

Did you get a fair price Daniel? Good choice by the way! Will be waiting for pics

 

Here is an overview with various rims and spacers for the 599 GTB.

I like it, wheels going out to the fenders, so this overview will help to see if spacers are necessary/possible with the most interesting rim variants for the 599.

You can use the excel file to calculate other rims.
Fill out the grey fields with your own rim datas.

Daniel

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I think yes, they gave me a acceptable price.

Daniel

 

Interesting to know, if all models uses the 52mm wheel bolts ?

Who knows this ?


The hub center is about 10mm long, so 10mm spacers are difficult with a new hub center.
12-15 mm spacers with new hub center will work with longer bolts.
With 5mm spacers you can use the original hub center.
More than 15mm I would use only the spacer system which is installed onto the hub with new bolts and rims are installed to spacers with original bolts.

Titanium bolts are on the market with
52mm
62mm
68mm

Daniel

 

Hi Guys

The GTO rims arrived today.

Manufacturer is AppTech Srl. from Italy, they produce forged high end rims for Ferrari, Porsche Lamborghini, ...., they are part of the Ronal group.

I believe the first series of GTO rims came from BBS, these are the rims with the thinner spokes.
So the thicker spoke GTO rims are the ones from AppTech.

I took some measures with the Monolitic 11 inch rims with the 315/35 I have, and I think 20mm spacers are no problem.
So I decided to order Titanium bolts in 52mm like the Originals and try my 22mm spacers at the rear and without spacers at the front.
If the 22 mm will not work, I can go to 20mm.

I ordered a set of 20x 52mm 17mm hexagon Titanium bolts from a German company (a very good brand) which is specialized in spacers and fitment parts.
Price for all 20 bolts is 700 €.

Daniel

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Weight of the 11,5x20 rear rim is incredible 10,5 Kg !!!

Daniel

 

One more detail

With the spacers you install at the hub with 5 bolts, you can use the original 52mm bolts only when the spacers have 20mm.
The bolt needs 20mm depth.

Daniel

 

Daniel- Those GTO wheels look great. The 9.5" front wheels should cut down on understeer and make her turn in better. The 599 GTB was always under-wheeled for 600+ hp.

 

I always liked the original GTO wheels, but these AppTech wheels have really grown on me. They must be stronger than the originals.

 

George

They are original, but 2nd generation.
Ferrari is stamped inside.

The 2 rears are manufactured 12/2011
The fronts are from 2016 and 2019

Can someone confirm, that the GTO rims with the thinner spokes are from BBS ?

Daniel

 

When you knock onto the rims (with the finger), you can't believe that they are so strong.
It sounds like knocking onto an aluminum sheet.



Daniel

 

Yes,yes I understand they are original. They look awesome!

 

You like more the thicker spokes ?
For me the thinner are a little bit more elegant.



But I like them.

Daniel