F8 or STO?

STO is the most exciting new release. Coupled with its race pedigree (from the STS and GT3 series) this car ticks every box. EVO's 2020 eCoty rated the EVO-RWD very highly (765LT, EVO-RWD and M2 CS) and the STO is a massively amped up version of the evo-RWD.

Those getting one - Congrats !!!!!~

 

completely agree! sto spyder will be awesome!

 

Is it known yet whether the STO will have GPFs? Perhaps this could explain why they didn’t (couldn’t) increase the power?

 

No GPFs on initial deliveries as relayed to me. This could change as speculation is 2022s in EVO.

 

Also won Motor Trends coty, beating the F8 and 992 Turbo S. I was impressed by their comments on how much they raved about it.

 

Motortrend's Pcoty judges made it clear the Huracan Evo drove like a whole different car to any of the previous Huracan versions which were quoted as (all) being unconvincing in various ways. This is why the Evo finished as high as it did - as it didn't drive like the predecessors - but even so they made certain criticisms which didn't place the Evo H noticeably higher in overall score than the other cars, which all finished very closely to one another. Going by the combined judgments, the engine, sound and super-car presence was essentially what placed the EVO car above the others.

The 3 attached reviews for the STO, 765LT, and F8 show an interesting final rating summary which place the cars overall. If you open them all in separate links and flip between the final summary boxes you will get a better picture of the different placings. Enjoy!

https://www.caradvice.com.au/902264/2021-lamborghini-sto-review-prototype-test/
https://www.caradvice.com.au/888115/2021-mclaren-765lt-review/
https://www.caradvice.com.au/829638/2020-ferrari-f8-tributo-track-review/

 

I generally don’t pay much attention to a magazine’s reviews, but I agreed with the F8’s weaknesses. The EVO.......I should know in due time.

 

Very keen to hear your views on the EVO. There were a few great journo's on the eCOTY (Meaden, Catchpole and Bovinton) who I respect and who "say it as it is". All seemed to really bond with the EVO.

 

Well, I was locked and loaded to drive one yesterday at Lambo Charlotte. I’d been waiting awhile as this one was the RWad Spyder with sport seats (roomier), a necessity for my slightly larger frame. The car arrived on Wed. evening and someone bought the damn thing before I got there on Saturday, so all I got was seat time, lol. Good news is I fit in the present configuration, which is a victory in and of itself.

To really test this car, you need seat time and open, twisty roads, and a bit of gusto to ring it out a bit. For the benefit of all the good folks here who are interested, I will do so. Probably take it into the mountains and really give it a thrashing.

Looks like I’ll have to order one (might as well get it exactly as I’d like anyway) which should take about 6 months ( still shorter then the F8). Nicely spec’d looking at 270-ish. I may delay my order a bit as I’d rather take late fall- early winter delivery in FL. And I should have additional (conditioned) garage space for it by then as well.

 

Sounds good. Keen to hear your reviews when you have driven the EVO

 

There is no doubt that the STO will be a special car. To compare it to the F8 is looking in the wrong direction. It should be compared to the Pista and the Mclaren 765LT. The STO is Lamborghini's answer to the track focused, all out assault on the regular production version of the EVO, just as the Pista represents the same compared to the F8 and the 765 is to the 720S. After being so enamoured by the thrilling driving dynamics of the Performante and the EVO RWD, the STO seemed like the logical successor for ownership. Instead I opted for the 765LT. My hesitation on purchasing the STO centered on the fact that the engine was essentially unchanged with no increase in power. Similar sentiments was the reason I did not opt for the Pista after owning the F8. It became clear that the V10, a materpiece in its own right, was already maximized in terms of power and equally or perhaps even more apparent, was the fact that providing adequate grip and traction in a RWD was not possible with more power. For reasons unknown, both Ferrari and and even more so for Mclaren, have been capable of designing high power engines AND tenacious grip and control, somethig that has eluded Lamborghini. In all Lamborghi RWD models, Balboni, 580-2 and EVO RWD, HP was reduced compared to their AWD counterparts yet still suffered with the attendant reduction in grip upon launch and less traction in hard cornering. Hopefully, I will be given the opportunity to drive the STO and have my mind changed.

 

IMO hp is not everything. I eat GT2RS's, Pista's etc on track in my 570S GT4 track car with 40% less hp. The STO is supposed to be a track car for the road and Lamborghini has taken this idea to the limit and spent its energy/$$ on the cars dynamics via aero, downforce, brakes etc etc rather than hp.

Going to be really interesting once reviews start to arrive. But if the EVO RWD is anything to go by its going tp be epic

 

Totally agree. Sounds like much work was done on the suspension too. If the STO is really almost 3 seconds faster than the Performante and just 2.5 seconds slower than the Evo GT3 race car around Daytona, that will make for a close to class leading performer. Indeed, if those times are accurate, that would make it faster than a GT2 RS by a decent margin. For the money, I am not sure anything will be faster than a STO around a normal circuit.

Here’s the GT2 RS vs the Performante:

https://zeperfs.com/en/duel6639-6810.htm

https://fastestlaps.com/comparisons/23a6s0z5u2jc

 

Agreed although it’s not really appropriate to compare a pure race car against a street car. It also depends on the track. A GT2 RS lapped quicker than a 570S GT4 at Mosport for example.

 

Fair point but I am talking about "normal dudes" like me who are not professionals on a track. I wanted to make the point that hp is only one aspect of a car. The Cayman GT4 is another example of a road car that punches way above its weight belt. Its dynamics are superb and it can perform against other cars with substantially more hp. Again in the hands of "normal dudes" which I assume mostly are on these forums.

 

Preach!

 

Way too many variables to compare track times between these cars. Regardless, they are all faster than most of us can drive or willing to drive their own cars on a track so no matter how epic the STO (or other car) is the driver will never know the full potential other than an online reference. This is the reason I bought the 488 Challenge car and will be running Club Challenge this year. Its fun to compare and debate but really meaningless if you are buying a street car to enjoy on the road.

 

Absolutely. Track, driver, and car are all relevant on a circuit. I've also seen drivers in track focused cars run faster than dedicated circuit cars too!

Drawing a comparison between a purpose built circuit car to a track focused street car is inappropriate unless the comparison is specifically about showing how capable the street car really is in the same pair of hands. So agree, things need to be kept in proper perspective here.

STO is 43kgs lighter than the Evo and, has no additional power, so any weight advantage could be lost fairly quickly depending upon fuel load and driver weight. Has anyone yet confirmed if STO uses rose joints in the suspension? I wasn't hearing anything said in the Pcoty review other than the EVO had been significantly improved over Performante so I'm not so sure there would be all that much left on the table to improve after these latest changes (on EVO) that would make a massive difference to circuit times, least of all in the hands of most buyers.

From what Im reading so far on the STO is that the steering feel and harsher ride is what is providing more of a raw engaging driving experience than what the EVO is currently providing most drivers. Its clear the main objective/purpose of the STO was to provide a more raw experience than anything else. That said I'm sure a pro driver could extract a superior lap time due to being able to utilize the improved Airo and more race inspired suspension/chassis set. Average drivers i'm not so sure, and on most roads where these cars will mostly get driven chances are the set up will make the car slower off a circuit than an EVO especially when the power is the same.

 

Keep in mind even cars like Yaris and type R can keep pace on a tight windy road as pointed out in Pcoty, so the advantages of having extra power can become counterproductive along with an overly stiff chassis set up which can throw the car off line.

Cayman gt4 is also a very easy car to drive fast - very well sorted small mid mount car with precision controls. It is a very forgiving car. This can make it impossible for a higher powered exotic to escape especially when the brakes do not modulate well and the control of the power delivery is not smooth as is the case in some of these high priced exotics (Ferrari namely one that immediately comes to mind).

 

The GT4 can carry a lot of speed into the corners and get out decently quick.

 

Absolutely. It's a car that can also make a driver look a lot better than what they really are too! A lot less skill is required to drive a Cayman Gt4 fast than pretty well most exotics I've driven. It's still a blast of a car to drive though but mainly because of how Porsche has engineered it to deliver solid driver engagement even though it is not as engaging to drive as some exotics and 911 chassis Gt cars....which also require more skill to push at the same pace.

 

Even the regular Cayman and/or 718 do a great job in corner loaded roads. And does it make the driver look good! That is an understatement. That car is absolutely well balanced. It is a car that is frequently underrecognized and underestimated.

 

Absolutely.

And this is what concerns me about having a car that is too rigid and unresolved in the suspension set up, where the main focus of the set up is to produce a fast lap time to impress officials recording for zeperfs and the likes. Desirably a track focused rd car is set up in balance so to provide access to the performance potential on and off circuit and, not be too heavily weighted in one direction - as in circuit. Because by and large these cars are not circuit cars and are bought to be driven largely on varying road surfaces - driven mostly by users who are not pro racers.

If you go back over the summaries which I posted up earlier regarding ride quality and handling you will see STO is rated the worst out the bunch for ride quality even in comparison to Porsche Gt3rs which is a bit stiffer than Gt2.

https://www.caradvice.com.au/747213/2019-porsche-911-gt3-rs-review/

https://www.caradvice.com.au/902264/2021-lamborghini-sto-review-prototype-test/

 

A few years ago a group of friends gathered up, amongst which there was my GT2, a Gallardo, 991.1 C4S, Cal T, R8V10+, GTR, a Cayman and others. In the straightaways, there was no chance for the poor thing (although I must admit, it surprised me because it did a lot better than thought). However, in corners, that little f....er was right behind me all the time.

 

This is how it is in the tight stuff and I imagine the same would apply to a Yaris Gr or Integra Type R now. The super cars are not so super as they used to be. And the stiffer, less compliant and/or less resolved in feel, the worse they are off a circuit. That said I note Car advice did give STO a slightly higher fit for purpose rating as a track focused car than the others previously listed. So that's some consolation for those who will use it purely as a dedicated circuit car - except for the gt3rs which got a 10.