F430 F1 transmission problem with temperature | FerrariChat
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F430 F1 transmission problem with temperature

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Peluca, Nov 15, 2021.

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  1. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

    Jan 13, 2018
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    Michel Durand
    #1 Peluca, Nov 15, 2021
    Hi everyone, I hope someone can help me out I have had a problem with my transmision for a while now.

    When the car is cold everything work ok, gears from N to 1 are fast, it goes from 1 to R directly and all gears work perfectly.
    After the car is hot in a 20 or more minute drive going fast. The first abnormal situation is that when going from N to 1 it takes longer and the car wont go from 1 to R directly I have to select N first.
    Also sometimes it Weill fail to engage a gear and go to neutral and be stick there for about 10 minutes. After it cools down everything is back to normal again.
    I have changed a lot of things now with no success.
    1- Actuator leak fixed.
    2- New pump and accumulator.
    3- New actuator potentiometers.
    4- Bleed screws checked.
    5- New clutch installed and PIS setup correctly according to factory specs.
    6- gear calibration was donde cold and hot.
    7- Relay changed.

    The car is at the Ferraris dealer but we are out of ideas on how to fix this problem. The only certain thing is that the car fails only when it is hot.

    Anyone has had a similar issue? I would really appreciate any ideas.

    Thanks for any help…

    Michel
     
  2. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
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    #2 flash32, Nov 15, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2021
    Have them check the solenoids the leak rates on the power unit


    Also you possibly have a bad new sensors ..cause the problem does point to those even though you changed them
    Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk
     
  3. windsock

    windsock Formula 3
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    #3 windsock, Nov 15, 2021
    Common issue. IS this a 2007 and earlier or a 2008 and later as they are very different? If this is the dealer have they performed the Ediff leak test? Losing reverse hot is a very common symptom for a shift actuator not centered or a PIS set too tight. Saying PIS is set to factory specs is a huge window and it is common for the PIS to get set to tight. Once the car is warm the clutch expands and drags which causes the input shaft to still turn when attempting to get into reverse. The dealer should have performed a gear grid calculation and documented the centering of the shift actuator, centered it and perform it again to confirm proper centering. there are a lot of dealers that no longer have techs that are fluent in 430 and earlier cars.
     
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  4. stasha

    stasha Karting

    Sep 10, 2021
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    steve steve
    #4 stasha, Nov 15, 2021
    No wait. I'm ignorant and i don't want to waste time researching...but, "solenoids"? Is this an automatic?
     
  5. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
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    #5 flash32, Nov 15, 2021
    The F1 systems has solenoids to engages thru hydraulic pressure the clutch and moves the actuator which changes the gears like your right hand would on a regular manual

    Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk
     
  6. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

    Jan 13, 2018
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    Michel Durand
    #6 Peluca, Nov 17, 2021
    We dismounted the actuator and found some gear move together with others. Please check the video. Is this normal behavior or this could be the problem?



    Any ideas and how to fix this would be great.

    Michel
     
  7. windsock

    windsock Formula 3
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    #7 windsock, Nov 19, 2021
    No

    Normal
     
  8. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
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    The Cold North
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    Tom
    #8 tbakowsky, Nov 19, 2021
    Do this test..easy to do..no scan tool required.

    With the car cold..open the door. Listen for the f1 pump. Wait unit it stops running.

    Get in the car..shut the door and key up..do not start the car. With key in position 2 (just before crank position).. wait for F1 pump to stop cycling once again.

    Put foot on brake..and shift 1,2,R. You should be able to select those gears without the F1 pump turning back on. If the pump cycles during this test..your accumulator is shot and needs replacment.

    If it passes this test cold...repeat when engine is hot and see how it reacts.
     
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  9. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

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    Michel Durand
    #9 Peluca, Nov 22, 2021
    Why not, I do not think that the top ones should move toghether. I would appreciate what you think.

    Thanks Michel
     
  10. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

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    #10 Peluca, Nov 22, 2021
    I have done this test and I am able to move the gear with no problem I can change the gears a few times and then the pump come on which is normal. Both, the pump and accumulator are brand new. So do not think the problem is there.
    Remember the problem only happens when the car is very hot.

    Michel
     
  11. windsock

    windsock Formula 3
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    #11 windsock, Nov 22, 2021
    This problem happened a lot on early 430 and occurred on every single 430 challenge car we had early on. Reverse was fine until you came off track and then it would no longer engage reverse. It was always due to a centering issue.
     
  12. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

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    Michel Durand
    #12 Peluca, Nov 22, 2021

    But in this case R come in you just need to go to N first. Also it is strange that it takes longer to go from N to 1.

    Those two gears stuck in the video I uploaded seem strange.
     
  13. windsock

    windsock Formula 3
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    #13 windsock, Nov 22, 2021

    Remember the tow shoes on each side of the shifting finger prevent the adjacent shift rods from moving and prevent actuating two gears. Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  14. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

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    Michel Durand
    #14 Peluca, Nov 22, 2021

    So to your opinion the problem is no those two getting stuck toghether and it is adjusting the finger to hace the correct center?
     
  15. windsock

    windsock Formula 3
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    #15 windsock, Nov 22, 2021
    Yes I would perform the centering operation very carefully. The other thing to check would be looking at input shaft RPM and engine RPM. If you have anything causing drag in the clutch and it causes input shaft speed to be present you will not get Reverse as there is no synchro but you may be able to get 1st which is synchro'd. Putting it is first stops the input shaft and then you can get reverse.
     
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  16. Peluca

    Peluca Rookie

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    #16 Peluca, Nov 22, 2021

    Thanks!!! One important thing we got anothe F430 who is working great. Changed the actuator and the problem with a still there. So I do not think the problem is the actuator. Also we checked and there is no drag.
     
  17. spydermanf360

    spydermanf360 Rookie

    Aug 5, 2006
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    #17 spydermanf360, Oct 9, 2024
    Were you able to resolve this problem? I have a 2007 F430 Spider with the exact same symptoms.
     
  18. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
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    #18 flash32, Oct 9, 2024
    My recommendation is for you to open a new thread , introduce yourself a little ( how mechanically inclined you are) , more about the car ( miles, when purchased, when problem started ) and I am sure we can help you
     
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