Doesn't matter. It was an illegitimate race if there ever was one, and it effected the championship, pure and simple. But it was allowed to stand because that's the way motorsports go. You'll just have to learn to deal with it.
Beside, nobody noticed a thing at the time. It was only Nelson Piquet Jr who revealed the plot one year later, under pressure from his father. I am not even sure if Flavio Briatore and Pat Symmonds accepted responsability. Anyway, they got banned from F1, and Renault was fined heavily. The sponsors deserted the team that was sold to Gerard Lopez and renamed Lotus. But that's a completely different context than Abu Dhabi, where one FIA official is"on trial".
Hey man I know you're excited you found a new word but you gotta switch it up. You know, simpen ain't easy.
Yes, but this was the big one where he would eclipse the great Schumacher and claim GOAT. He may or may not still get there...but it gets less likely with every year from now on.
But Hamilton has already overtaken Schumacher in many ways anyway: number of poles, number of podiums, number of wins, number of laps led, etc ... All this having raced in less GPs (9). Obviously an 8th title would have been the cherry on the cake, but it may prove elusive now.
And really what is the boner about lulu? really what is it? I may have seen a mere few instances of mediocre greatness. Im sorry but to me he needs to try harder than actting like hes busy wiping sweat. And asking for a rubber band from Angela
"This much" are the key words. Hamilton supporters have always promoted wild ass conspiracies about the 2007 season, claiming that the FIA made McLaren orchestrate losing the wild driving championship, and sabotaged Hamilton on purpose. Then there was 2016, when Hamilton lost a few engines, and conspiracies began that the Mercedes team were sabotaging his engines. British media pundits have stirred the pot on these theories, and Lewis himself has implied them on a few occasions. This is just the water finally boiling. The "if Hamilton loses, it was rigged" nonsense is simply out in the mainstream now.
Unbelievable. So Briatore and Symmonds getting banned and some sponsors leaving Renault make Singapore 2008 legitimate? You people are asking for a whole race to be invalidated because of a hypothetical official error, yet you don't support a race that was outright fixed and changed the world championship being invalidated? Gee, wonder why that is. Could it be that your guy won the former and not the latter? Nah, couldn't be. After all, Hamilton's posse only care about the sanctity of the sport, and would never, ever apply a double standard that varies according to what benefits Hamilton alone.
Yep. 4-5 since 2015 and that's added up. Also, Hamilton has been lucky in the Mercedes advantage over the rest of the field being more brutal than any era before it, lasting longer, and with nobody able to take the title fight with Mercedes to the last races until last year. Even in 2017 Ferrari faded fast after Mercedes showed their true power after the summer break.
I think the double dnf at Singapore is where Ferrari lost the plot that season. That started a trend of pit wall errors and falling apart. I thought Arrivabene took on the task with the right energy, but when things started to go wrong, he couldn’t get the train back on the track.
so, you’re basically articulating your belief that the only people complaining about that race at Abu Dhabi are diehard Hamilton fans? If so, I think that conversely would suggest that you will justify any result as long as it benefits your chosen ox (or penalizes the one you dislike). The presumption that Camp Max operates with total objectivity and has an unbiased view ignores the reality of the situation. Often times, the goal is to nullify the opinions of any who finds fault with Masi’s actions (like Ogier or the many times Nuvolari, non-Hamilton fan, has tried to explain what Masi did wrong from a racing perspective in a very calm and factual fashion) versus considering that he may have cocked things up. If this was a Max bash-fest, I could somewhat understand the defensive posture. This is a Masi ‘screwed up deal’ (which he did much of the season) but Team Max defends him like defending Max himself? I don’t get it….
True, but Mercedes showed the true power of their engine after the summer break, and Ferrari didn't have an answer for it. That's something that Mercedes have been able to do brilliantly these past few seasons when need be.
1. I'm not huge on Max and before this season, I found him very immature, and still don't care for how aggressive he is. That said, I've never cared for Hamilton's aggressiveness either, and from where I sit, Max was by far the better driver throughout the season, and Hamilton was lucky that several incidents caused by Hamilton-Bottas plus a tire failure, cost Max a good 50 points, and were the only reason Hamilton was even with Max at the end. 2. I don't actually hate Hamilton. Much as I'm a Ferrari fan and Singapore 08' burns me up, Ferrari cost Massa the title with their terrible pitstop. That was in their control. They didn't deserve to win the title, and when Hamilton snatched the title back out of Massa's hands, I was actually content with that. He drove the better season then, as Max did last year, and he deserved the title. 3. For the most part, the only people still bitching about the result at Abu Dhabi are Hamilton backers. Let's be real. The second Max won the title, before any of these people were aware of the exact protocol of the SC, Hamilton's, Toto, and their supporters were crying that the end was unfair already. The bitching about the regs was simply a retroactive apologetic to excuse the absolutely terrible sportsmanship they've shown since the checkered flag fell. I've listened carefully to a lot of people complaining about the end of Abu Dhabi who support Hamilton, and what they all have in common is that the real complaint is that Hamilton's lead vanished into thin air because of the safety car, and being in second gave Max an advantage to do the opposite of whatever Hamilton did if the race went green. I've heard people commenting on the end, who are making analogies to stick and ball sports, demonstrating they're completely ignorant about the variables that are unique to motorsport competitions that have been present from the beginning. That's the real beef. That's the real issue. It's not about Masi or the regs. It's that Hamilton's lead went away at the safety car and it was bad luck. Lastly, the opinions of Ogier and Nuvolari couldn't be more irrelevant. They never raced F1 and probably know less about the sporting regs and the history of official decisions than most on this board.
"unusual" does not equal "illegal". The fatal flaw in all of your "cop" analogies is that your cops are engaging in illegal activities ... speeding and running red lights just to get to the donut shop, or executing an illegal search without a warrant. Sure, cops have the "power" to do such things, because they have hands and feet controlled by their brains. And you're trying to equate that to the Race Director, who has a mouth and a radio. But the critical difference is that there are rules and laws that explicitly, clearly regulate the cops behavior ... if they cross the line, they are immediately in violation of these explicit rules and laws. No such rules exist for the F1 Race Director, in regards to the safety car ... in fact, the Race Director has "over-riding authority over the safety car", without qualification (i.e., relating to other "Sporting Regulations"). Your latest analogy would only apply if police officers were given "over-riding authority" concerning searches, with no qualifications relating to any other laws. In short: "power" and "authority" are very different things. Perhaps Abu Dhabi exposed a weakness in the rules ... rules that will be changed in the future. We'll soon see ... but that doesn't mean that Masi exceeded his authority, according to the rules as currently written. Quite the opposite, in fact ... when a rogue cop exceeds his authority and executes an illegal search, you'll have trouble finding a judge who decides that a change in the search-laws is what's required.
I find Horners comments during the race " we need intervention from the racing gods" as luck would have it it duly arrived............funny / lucky / coincidence!! Just saying
Correction, the surge in power wasnt investigated by the FIA unlike Ferrari's sudden gains in that department. If it was under consideration it was to late in the season to stop it. Clever /crafty.
This is in all your head. The people bitching about the Abu Dhabi race just don't want to see it happen again. And they are also the ones bitching about some of the inconsistent decisions by the stewards/Massi throughout the season. F1 needs to sort itself and become a sport again.
Nah, I resemble Kimi's remark. I like Ham, BUT I think the decisions of the race director and stewards this season affects the credibility of F1. I along with many of us here have bitched about the consistent inconsistency of the stewards' decisions. Come on, a three lap race under safety car?
It's still suspect though, isn't it? What IF Mercedes was doing something illegal with the engine and won both titles with it? If the FIA only investigated after the season, damage would be done... And still, if they investigated what Merc was doing and want to prevent it from happening next year, by investigating, they could at the very least close that. As it stands now, lets assume the engine is legal and they simply upped the power massively and reduce life (somehow still this is a reliability upgrade). The ICE wears out twice as quick. But the engine penalty for changing the ICE is only 5 places...and no financial penalty, either! With another engine freeze coming, this will be a huge advantage. The only place where this engine penalty is an actual penalty is at Monaco. With how quickly Ferrari was investigated every time they made a power upgrade and the measures the FIA took, I find it highly suspect in the least. Same goes for the magic suspension, double walled airbox cooling and DRS trick. Late in the season, yes. But if it's an easy spotted trick for any of these, it doesn't matter if it's near the end of the season. IF you're competing with an illegal car, it should be stopped...
F1 is as much a sport now as it's ever been. If you think inconsistency in stewarding was something that started with Masi, you've been living under a rock. It's always been inconsistent, and often at times, in ways far worse than last year. Some changes I think are needed are as follows. 1. At the display of the safety car, the pits should be closed. This will prevent safety cars from interfering in tire strategies, and handicapping the leader for domination over the field. 2. Engine changes need stronger penalties. The grid should be building for reliability in the name of cost control. When a team hits their 4th engine, they should have to start from the pitlane, so their advantage over the field is cancelled out. 10 grid spots is not enough. 3. Avoidable contact needs to be policed more. In the name of "letting them race" stewardship has become to lenient, imho, and there are too many NASCAR style bonehead moves being tolerated all along the grid, and the stewards need to reign it in. 4. No more team principles allowed a communication to race control. The reasons are obvious.
