I've said for a while Ferrari needs to build a plain jane building somewhere and hire Toyota to build the cars. They can then be shipped to the main factory in the dead of the night and roll off the line the next day. I'm not joking. I have a Toyota Highlander with 185k miles on it that has never thrown a check engine light. My Maranello had check engine lights so often the Ferrari service manager recommended I cover up the light with black tape. I asked an engineer for an explanation of the difference. He said, Toyota learned how to protect chips from water and heat, Ferrari, not so much.
I owned a 575 Maranello for 6 years never had a check engine light or any other issue, was super reliable. I was fastidious with maintenance though but I am the same with all my cars. As has been said before the SUV is the cash cow and the company since listing is no longer the Ferrari we once knew.
Apart from Porsche I stopped favoring high performance car brands like Ferrari and Lamborghini because they have lost a bit of soul because of these SUVs (atleast to me). I completely understand why they made SUVs because everyone wants to make money and it would grow the business and allow additional funds to be allocated elsewhere. But the whole tailormade/ad personam experience for an SUV just sounds weird to me. It's cool we live in a market that now allows though. I now prefer more boutique brands like Pagani or Bugatti that make the cars in smaller numbers but also only make cars that come from their heritage not a cash-grab. More power to Ferrari though, if I was a shareholder or an executive I'd want to make as much money for the company as possible. Small Pee Pee, Big Heart
It's all subjective, and I respect your opinion. I will admit though, I can't understand how you can say a Huracan EVO or Monza SP1/2 have no/less soul. Ford F150s/Chevy Equinox/Dodge Ram is why the Ford GT/Corvette/Demon exists. I find the argument that the existence of LM002 somehow diluted the Contach/Diablo or say the 412 the F40 odd, to say the least. This faux search for 'purity' makes me chuckle. Do you prefer a 69 chateau Laffitte? Why? Cuz it's so different (better?) from today's vintages. You don't say.
I am not referring to the specific cars. I completely agree both the EVO and Monza are emotional cars and both brands will continue to make great soulful cars with their own flair. To me atleast it just takes away the specialness of the brand as a whole when they are making SUVs and what the brands are most well known for (sports cars). There are now less mainstream manufacturers known for only building sports cars like their heritage, but times are changing. That's exactly it though the allocated funds from this SUV will be used to continue to grow the brand and allow other things to suffice. I don't agree that the LM002 diluted the brand. I think it's incredible they put the engine from a Countach into an off roader that seemed completely experimental at the time when SUVs when as in demand as they are now. Now it just seems like it's a money grab which goes back to my first posting you quoted. Small Pee Pee, Big Heart
I fundamentally disagree. Having an SUV (or any derivative) does not necessarily mean any 'sport' dilution to said brand. You yourself mention Porsche. The Macan/Cayenne/Panamera/Taycan do NOT DILUTE the 911 GT2 RS or the Cayman GT 4RS, on the contrary - they are what makes it possible to have them. Just do a little history studying on Porsche when they were about to go bankrupt. Hell, the (M.. Is Always The Answer) exists because of the CX-5, CX-9, etc. The Toyota Supra/FRS/Boxster/ are possible because of moms and pops buying a load of Rav-4s. The Honda NSX, S2000, Type-Rs were possible because of Civics, Accords, and CRVs The Nissan GTR/400Z is possible because of Nissan Rogues and Pathfinders. The mother of all examples is Scuderia Ferrari funded by Ferrari SpA.
What you said is all true. I'm super glad the Camaro/Corvette still exist with strong presence because GM has sold all these Escalades and Blazers etc. The Miata example you said puts it into perspective. Those more mainstream brands like Mazda/Ford/Chevy also sell to the masses who rely on these vehicles because they are affordable and suit their needs. Their sports cars are for the enthusiast like you and I which represents a smaller population of the buyer. Those brands mentioned I'd say the average person thinks of an SUV or a 4 door mid sized compact car that's used for city commutes not their sports cars unless it's an enthusiast. With Ferrari the first thing people most likely associate with them is sleek two door luxury supercar that goes fast. SUV would be the last thing I think of for them when someone mentions their name. I guess you could say this is the opposite of the mentioned brands above in a statement like: Ford is known for building F150s but they also build GTs. Ferrari is known for building two seater supercars but they also build this SUV. Just my personal opinion. I am not trying to attack or put anyone down. Side note: I am not sure if someone has already mentioned this here as I have not read the entire thread yet but what does everyone think old man Enzo would say if he was still alive and witnessed an SUV being made from Ferrari. Would he be like "Hell yeah brother we're going to make a bunch of them and make more money" or would he think "This is not what I imagined Ferrari doing ever." Small Pee Pee, Big Heart
Well, given his personal Ferrari is what purists like you argued against; what do you want me to say? View attachment 3277585
The LM002 was intended for military operations, able to sprint across sand dunes...it was never intended for civilian consumption but that's where it went after the military angle did not work out... https://www.military.com/off-duty/why-us-troops-blew-uday-husseins-rare-lamborghini-suv-iraq.html
It is virtually impossible to answer that question because Enzo from the sixties was very different from Enzo in the eighties, simply because the man had to run a huge business with incredible responsibilities. Both the man and his company went through quite a bit of change over the decades. Enzo in this era (2022) would have definitely adapted and changed his opinion on certain levels, but making predictions whether he would have agreed to an SUV is impossible. I say one thing though: just look at the Pinin and especially how that 'proposal' ended up... Natan
I heard the same re high prices. Will probably be close to 500k. Sent from my BBF100-6 using FerrariChat.com mobile app
It was my understanding that Enzo was actually quite excited about the Pinin. If not, why even approve the concept? It was Ghidella that was not keen on it for business reasons. Fioravanti said the fit/finish was specifically the cause of the demise, not the premise. I'm open to being corrected. My thesis is simple, if the Enzo was open to the idea of a large 4 door sedan, it does not take any stretch of the imagination to posit he would approve other derivatives that occupy the same market position today.
little surprised to see the result of the poll. by Ferrari making an SUV, will the rest of the line become less fun, racy, sporty? If so, I guess a Ferrari SUV is a "bad" idea. Porsche makes SUV for 20+ years now, their GT3/GT4/Turbo line up is absolutely spectacular.
Agreed. The Tesla Model X did not make the Model S any slower. The Urus did not cause Lamborghini Hurrican STO to vanish, the G-wagon did not cancel the AMG ONE, McLaren's extreme E (electric SUV) did not make the Speedtail lose anything, the BMW M5 Competition was not 'diluted' by the X7. The Guilia QF was not compromised because of the Stelvio or upcoming Tonale... need I go on? The irony is it's these bread/butter models that allow these rare-extreme hyper cars to exist in the first place. Want crazier, more exotic, more focused, more soulful, more extreme, more distilled cars? Then support the SUV. Nobody forces a person to buy a Macan over a 911 GT2. It's simply that due to the Macan, the 911 GT2 can exist in its full glory. I like the 911 GT2, so by extension, I like the Macan.
The problem is that the SUV blurs the difference between Ferrari and other marques. For example, Land Rover only does premium off road vehicles. The new Defender is a perfect mud-n-guts vehicle, and the Range Rover line is opulence that can go pretty much anywhere. If Land Rover decided to make a low-slung V12 supercar, it would be odd, at best. I put my dollars on Land Rover’s expertise in off road luxury, and accept that the company knows zero about motor sports. Back to Ferrari: Its DNA is in racing, and while an F1 car wouldn’t work around town the marque’s unique asset is its storied expertise in motor sports. A tall, heavy vehicle? Leave it to others. Ferrari has customers queued up to pay $300,000+ for every car it can make. Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Well, maybe it is time for some World SUV World Championship racing series, or GT-SUV class in FIA WEC... In WRC Ford has already decided that its new rally car must look like Puma SUV. Ferrari will have to face new challenges in near future - phasing out the ICE and switching to EV will cost money, and they have to earn it. So the SUV seems to be very logical move. And speaking about Enzo: remind me please, what happened to every idea he was opposed to? Mid-engine layout? Less than 12 cylinders? Automatic transmission?
Not to mention reluctant to adopt disc brakes, and no need for aero (that was for people who didn’t know how to build engines). I’m not sure why Enzo keeps getting brought up with regards to how to run Ferrari. I am more interested in what LDM would say, he strikes me as “more Ferrari than Ferrari.”
From the earnings presentation today, "Daytona SP3 and Purosangue commencing production in 2022 with deliveries in 2023"
This is 330 GT 2+2 chassis #4963 GT and NO, this was NOT Enzo Ferrari's personal car. It was a company car registered with SEFAC SpA on 10 January 1964 and was prototype #1 for the 330 GT. I have the paperwork for this. The fact that there is a photo showing the Commendatore about to sit in this car does not mean that this was Enzo's personal car. Marcel Massini
Thank you for the correction Marcel. Your wealth of knowledge is nothing short of impressive. I've read from different sources that the 330 GT 2+2 was a car Enzo drove personally, (not necessarily the specific car above) - is this accurate? Kind regards.
