"Product strategy" must align with realities... What are the realities? currently, EURO 7 regulations are still in-flux, originally set for finalization and acceptance at end of 2021, has been moved 6 months and now by 12 months (or maybe less, see below): https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-luxury-sports-cards-electric-models-co2-emissions-standards/ From link above: Not everyone is embracing the plan to end the derogation for small carmakers. The few elite vehicle manufacturers that are independents and can't average out their fleet-wide emissions across a sprawling family of brands say they will struggle to make the interim reduction targets coming in 2025 and 2030. "I do not think it's fair to punish Ferrari because it's an independent company," said Pietro Fiocchi, an Italian member of the European Parliament with the European Conservatives and Reformists group acting as shadow rapporteur on the file. "Potentially the CO2 debate could shut down Ferrari." https://cdn.ferrari.com/cms/network/media/pdf/ar_2020_ferrari_web.pdf (pp 84-85) Reading through what is currently in-flux, it is possible that a V12 812 successor could be eliminated due to it weighing down on the over all allowed CO2/other emissions (in EU). Reason being, the current production expectation is first production 2024Q3 or later, putting it directly in the path of punishing Euro 7 regulations and all other cars in Ferrari's fleet by that date will likely be hybrid or nearly completion of production (i.e. FUV). Of course, if a hybrid V12 was developed that would be more likely to align with EU CO2 regulations and other particulate emissions (NH3, N2O, CH4, HCHO - Ammonia, Nitrous Oxide, Methane, Formaldehyde) Or, maybe Euro 7 regulations will not be as restrictive as expected, or worse...it may have a longer lead time than 2025, etc. Developing a "product strategy" for a large non-hybrid V12 is challenging in this current situation...so Ferrari is hoping for the best but must be prepared for the worse. relevant reading: (or will EURO 7 regulations be known in 3 months or less?) https://smartsummit.net/euro-7-the-european-commission-proposal-by-july/ https://news.24happenings.com/technology/4849.html https://pr.euractiv.com/pr/fia-european-bureau-unveils-position-papers-euro-7-and-roadworthiness-231629 https://www.sae.org/publications/technical-papers/content/2022-37-0032/ https://www.sae.org/publications/technical-papers/content/2022-37-0008/
Look I might not own a ferrari but this digital era literally killed automobiles that are built for drivers. Cars these days have too much electronics/computer in it that it loses "that" mechanical factor that the timeless sports car and supercars have. Yes it might be fun to drive for you now but you can't barely feel the actual car itself as it is shrouded by these artificial stuff that are covering its weaknesses. PS: LaF is probably my favorite hypercar but if you are going to ask me which formula would I like? I'd rather have the same formula of the ferrari f50; RWD mid-engined V12 with manual transmission and weighs about 1 metric ton. Now if LaFerrari did have the same formula that the SP3 has I think it would have been a better car especially without that heavy electric motors. PPS: Ferraris are made to move your soul when driving it regardless whether you drive it fast or slow, Ferrari cars for me aren't supposed to be the ones that pioneers technological advancement like a Porsche 959 or a Nissan GTR. Ferrari cars are meant to be pure driving experience not a digital or artificial one. You can achieve mechanical advancement in the chassis without using too much electronic driver aids to be brutally honest just ask gordon murray
Definitely agree with the best looking part since it is the best looking modern ferrari especially without the stripes imho
Where does this belief stem from? What makes you believe that modern technology inhibits the interaction between driver and machine? If anything it is even greater now, as the machine does exactly what its driver tells it to do, instead of being a capricious death trap. Ferraris were all about speed from day one. What makes them faster would also make Enzo happier. Why should we take Murray's ideas as a gospel?
Like me he doesn't own one so doesn't have to actually drive it or live with it. No skin in the game so can just operate on pure nostalgia and conjecture lmao.
Quite simply because his vision of the sports car is the purest and most in line with that of the fans ! And because if Ferrari's one and only concern wasn't share price, that's the direction it should have gone.
Why are they purer? Because they are rudimentary? I believe that the clients vote with their wallets and as we can see they prefer Ferrari's/Lamborghini's/McLaren's interpretation of a supercar. The last time a Ferrari was offered as a manual it sold a few solitary units... The Valkyrie on the oither hand, yes that is a game changer! Full of technology too. BTW, Murray's cars are also full of electronics. They just forego the hybrid element... for the time being.
Because it's the opposite of the artificial sensations that the 296/SF 90 gives. Ferrari produces image cars today, enthusiasts , they don't give a damn...you will have noticed .
Most wouldn't be able to use the 3 pedals of a manual gearbox with a correct heel toe, so I don't care... I'm lucky to have the vision of a professional pilot, and it's the most instructive for me. ...
That's condescending and plain wrong as they are all seasoned drivers, some of them racers also. BTW, the best professional race drivers use paddles in their trade.
Ferrari reportedly spent $20m developing a manual gearbox for the California and only around 10 sold. There is simply no business case for a GMA style "pure sports car" for Ferrari today. The Ferrari road car business has never been stronger, which has allowed them to make extensive investments in their racing ops. The Scuderia are winning races again (finally), LMH launches soon, the 488 GT program has been the most successful in the marque's history. Enzo was always about racing. So perhaps Ferrari has never been truer to its original ethos than it is today. Win on Sunday, sell it on Monday! This idea that a better share price equals 'less soul' does not wash with me.
Let's put some more oil on this fire.... (!) Manual's are amazing for driver interaction, but try mating one with a 700hp+ car and achieve nice shifts. Cars these days are way to fast for manuals to be explored fully. The majority of drivers already have a hard time keeping up with paddle shifts here(Challenge driver speaking here!). Forget about manual shifting that car. I wouldn't be able to move hands and feet that fast!
would have preferred Ferrari to focus on weight reductions rather than power increases! In total agreement with the philosophy of this man (genial). All the cars that will go down in history will not be hybrids, I am absolutely certain of that! it is only consumable !
Agreed. I doubt we'll see a 296GTB in some shed with a few greased up old machanics trying to 'repair' the battery pack! It's probably the reason why cars like the original GTO are soo highly sought after. All Analogue. But hey, Ferrari has share and stock holders to please and posers that need to have a car with the most HP numbers.... As long as sales are up, why would they care....!? Consumers vote with their wallets.
Indeed, people are voting with their wallets. Take the example of the 812. That car has been polarizing from the very beginning. Even admirers and owners (myself included) think the design aesthetic is far from perfect. And, yet the valuation continues to increase. It’s clear to Mr. Market and the “wallet voters” that the 812 will be the pinnacle of Ferrari V12 perfection. Never to be duplicated, or even imitated, ever again. Get’em while you can…The 812 represents the demarcation between the purists/enthusiasts chasing the essence of Ferrari versus the nouveau riche chasing another luxury good to add to their portfolio. Ultimately, Ferrari will sell a crap ton of cars and make a crap ton of money, but there will be plenty of people that don’t follow them down the electrification path.
My Blackwing would like a word with you. 680ish hp, RWD, manual. It is one of the most fun and engaging cars available in the world today, and that includes manual Porsches and hypercars. Is it the fastest thing in the world? Of course not. Ask me how much a care about that. Image Unavailable, Please Login I'm not saying it's the best car out there for everyone, but the idea that a 700hp cars are too fast for a manual is silly. Yes the BW is a couple of disabled nannies away from wanting to kill you. For me, in cars as in women, I find the ones that want to murder me the most attractive. A modern manual RWD NA V12 from Ferrari would be automotive apotheosis.
Thought exercise…how many of these would Ferrari sell if they stuffed the 812 engine in it, developed a super lightweight gated gearbox, and had it come in less than 3,000lbs? Let’s say that they pulled out some sound dampening, and played around with the electrical nannies…er driver’s aids. How much could they charge? I have never paid $1M for a car (not even close), but I would buy one for that. I am sure I wouldn’t be alone. Image Unavailable, Please Login
I came a little at the thought. If you had used the words single mass flywheel I would have needed a defibrillator.
10M € and two units built, according to Roberto Fedeli (quoting Autocar here): "Fedeli said his experiences at Ferrari were enough to convince him that the manual transmission was dead. While developing the California roadster several years ago, he says, Ferrari invested €10m in a manual gearbox option and, overall, just two such cars were built for customers". https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/overhauled-alfa-romeo-4c-planned-2018-reveal
Why pick the California where one of the product strategies is that it could hold a bag of golf clubs!?! https://www.ferrari.com/en-US/auto/genuine/california-t/golf-bag I confidently believe if the 458 family had a manual option, a much different result would of occurred!
I agree, the problem is power is but an aspect of a driving experience but its not the only aspect in my view. How much power is usable in the real world and here is where I think EV's will end up walking down a road to nowhere because its a very one dimensional experience. Regarding a replacement for the 812 I would like less weight, more compact dimensions and perhaps a nod to the Roma in the guise of really elegant styling, I love the 812.
