812 Replacement Rumors

Agree
Looks like the next supercar will be a V6 hybrid.

 

I thought that too at first. But here are some counter arguments that suggest HYBRID TTV8:

1. If you follow the line visually, it connects directly with HYBRID V8 lineage.

2. Next Hypercar will HAVE to be quicker and more powerful than SF90.
It should ideally finally break the actual 1,000 bhp level for Ferrari. The optimal way to achieve that is to ‘hot rod’ the SF90 HYBRID V8 power plant using every trick in the racing engine book and add a next generation hybrid system and leading edge battery technology.

3. As a bonus … by doing this … you set the stage for a NON-HYBRID version of this engine to be used in an F40 Icona, making 2023 the year of the V8, just as 2021 was the year of the V12 ( 812C and SP3 ).

To have the Hypercar and the next Icona BOTH use a V8 power plant would be a nod to the future as well as the past … at the same time … a poetic way for Ferrari to celebrate it’s 75th anniversary.

 

Everything you said is plausible indeed.
But how do you justify Formula one and Le Mans technological transfers with a V8 TT when both racing cars will use a V6 TT ?
( V6 single turbo for F1)

 

This is another reason I thought TTV6 HYBRID at first. And of course, that could easily be the case as well. This is all conjecture. And that would indeed make sense for being more directly related to current racing activities. Here are the caveats to that though:

1. They speak of transfer of racing TECHNOLOGIES, not necessarily configuration. There is no law which confines ‘technology transfer’ to ‘same cylinder count.’ The Hypercar has ALWAYS been about technology transfer from racing. But when was the last time the factory raced a V12? I’m looking at you, LaFerrari.

2. Yes, hypothetically Ferrari CAN make a streetable V6 that has over 1,000 bhp and show the SF90 a clean set of heels. And yes, Mercedes-AMG took the lineage to its F1 power plant LITERALLY and Ferrari COULD do the same. But are they going to? Is Ferrari really going to sink all that effort into developing a high strung V6 for a small batch of cars when they have a juicy 4.0 liter V8 sitting right there that will do the job with some tweaks to the electrical bits? Look what it cost Mercedes-AMG in terms of development time and god knows how much expenditure.

3. Overall, I say 70% probability V8 and 30% V6. Zero % V12 unfortunately.

 

day355 said the front of the F167 will be inspired by a historical model. Initially I thought of the 275 GTB, but the face is too complex and has too much detail.
The 365 GTB/4 design was a big step forward: everything was put together in one strip and that still looks simple and modern today. I find the first series (without the pop-up headlights) particularly well done. Maybe the new F167 is based a bit on this genius look...
The Ferrari headlights are currently working also back to the horizontal, so I'm hoping for something from this "Daytona Look".

 

^^ Would love to see a modern interpretation of the Daytona ^^

 

Would love to see something that is pure, original, brilliant, simple, sensuous, and not an interpretation (read copy) of a PF or prior design. Not going to happen with this design lead.

 

I have a different take. From all of d355 comments and hints I feel it is going to basically be like a Roma on steroids … at once more voluptuous and more muscular. Basically if you love the Roma and hate the 812 … Ferrari is building this V12 for you.

Oh and you can assume this is going to be the actual last regular series production V12 as we know it …

 

The 296GT3 and Challenge cars will have the 296 turbo engine without the hybrid module.

 

Well... OK, but that's a stretch IMO if we need to look at the racing engines for that to become true.

 

Hmmmm, could be. However the Pista engine was also a more or less derrived from the 488 Challenge engine.
In fact, I heard more or less it's the exact same engine with a different mapping.

 

Just got back from Maranello. Did both museums, and the factory tour (which was epic)... all of which to say from the moment you set foot in the hallowed grounds of Maranello to the time you leave, you understand and feel how important, how essential the V12 is to Ferrari

From the first 125S in the Maranello museum, to it's engine deconstructed in the house that Enzo was born in in Modena, to factory workers being assigned to an individual V12 engine at a time (versus assembly line style for the turbo V8/V6s).. in fact most cars on display in both museums were equipped with...a V12

So if this goes away or becomes unobtainable for most clients (only icona/super specials), will be interesting to see Ferrari of the future and what that means

 

Roma?

 

Roma is a Beauty and has some but very little resemblance to a Daytona IMO

 

The failed effort to invoke the Daytona was the 812SF.

 

Disagree. The 812 is a masterpiece dynamically and aesthetically imho, even more so since the more generic subsequent Ferrari’s were introduced.

 

At this point it should be fair to ask what exactly would be a good, modern interpretation of the Daytona.

 

550 Maranello ?
Oh hang on that is 25 years old

 

As an owner of a 550 Maranello and an 812 SF, i only can say that this is the perfect combination for me.
A Daytona is out of my range, and with the 550 (the Daytona of the 90's) and the 812 SF (the Daytona from today) i need nothing else.

Daniel

 

No, it as a modern interpretation of the 275

 

That's sad. Ferrari should be a forward looking company, not doing retro designs.

 

None. Historically Ferrari’s approach was to make NEW designs with respect to the past, not rehash the past with retro poor rehash. That is the correct approach.

 

Well I totally agree with that! I was asking just because you called the 812 a failed effort, so curious as to what a proper effort would be to you. I take it NONE.

 

I was talking about the 550 Maranello which is a modern interpretation of the 275

 

To be done properly it has to be simply in the philosophy of the design or in a detail.