The end of Ferrari, as we know it

You really believe this?

a stock 1960s elan (even with power to weight ratio) can beat a stock stinger GT2 on or off the track?

Good lord

 

He really believes the 89 hp car (let’s be even generous and use the sprint model from the 70s with 110 hp) is beating the GT2.

wow, just when I thought I saw it all here on fchat.

the irony? The 2nd gen Elan was bought bought by who in the 90s?

you guessed it.

 

Look at this setup, I don't think you find it bigger at a private home - WK057 is a legend in the Tesla community

https://057tech.com/solar

 

We just had a guy that hates EVs also claim the 1962 89 hp Elan is going to run circles around the 370 hp 2023 Stinger GT2.

But we’re the deluded ones right?

 

I can think of one or two things that messes things up even more which is counter intuitive to the freedom you are advocating for, but I know better than to mention that to a Texan ;-) I think we would have a great time over a couple of beers.

 

I see solar power systems with a lot fewer panels than that, but they're not charging Teslas.

 

Yep

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

No idea what you are talking about computers, cell phones, flat screen TVs.

Costs for battery chemistry items are high and going higher as demand diminishes supply and new supply is not easy to acquire, prices will not only stay high but supply constraints will ensure production remains low.

As for charging at the office, hmm, many work from home, and, what charging at the office exists?, there is no such infrastructure now or ever (and 2 node station in a parking area able to hold 100s of cars is non-starter).

As for swappable EV battery packs, does not exist outside of some testing, never will actually exist (for one you would have to have an "industry agreement" to such otherwise you are talking each manufacturer has their own unique setup, that never will work), you talk about flammable products, when EVs are both flammable and full of electricity that can provide deadly shocks, check out a service center hazmat suits that need to be worn to work on the battery systems....

 

Huh?
When you can drive, fill up and return home in just a few minutes, why would having a gas pump at home be relevant? However, if you really wanted to, a 55gallon drum of gasoline could be home-delivered... Does your "friend" have a "level 3" $150,000+ charger and massive electric service that does not exist in residential areas in their home capable of a 45m-hour full EV charge?

 

You really have a strong believe in that things will not evolve from status quo

 

Deal, except I prefer a Bombay Sapphire martini!

 

I hope he's right lol

I'm a fan of electrifying things that don't need a soul or to convey emotion. Railways, airplanes, haulers, industry things, anything about A to B, sure even Teslas as commuters

Sports cars, and Ferrari in particular, I very much lament that

 

Wait let me get this straight, you both really , like really believe this?

To clarify, you’re both referring to a stock 60s elan?

 

I always have to remind myself some folks have either not gone out much or live in very rural areas.

As I said, this is a great thread to bookmark. One group will look very silly in 5-10 years. (Probably even shorter). I’ve been on fchat long enough where folks made bold proclamation we see here (like a stock 68’ S3 elan can out run say a stock 23’ Kia GT2) that it pretty much makes them lose all credibility. I like keeping tabs on who those folks are.

 

So what is soul and emotion? Is it only the engine that defines that?
https://www.icon4x4.com/derelict/pastprojects/37

 

Well I certainly don't speak for anyone but myself but yes it mainly relates to that, as far as enjoying a car is concerned for this 32 year old

I need Noise, Vibration, Harshness (now I'm not going to drive a tractor, but conversely I don't want to drive a silent heavy appliance)

The feeling of RPMs building then slamming into next gear, or braking and downshifting, the feeling that a car is light and agile, tossable, the smells of oil and gasoline, hot bits rubber on the exhaust, etc when the car is sitting in the garage after a good drive, noise in tune with power, cold starts... you know...the good stuff!

 

Excellent- Will use this!!!! He's buying the next damn round!!! I owe you one- Cheers

 

I don't know what a stock '23 Kia GT2 is, but if it's a GT model, then the appropriate comparison would be a stock Lotus Elan 26R. I'm thinking of an SUV. A standard Elan gets 0-60 in a bit over 7 seconds, which is probably slower than a modern SUV, but I very much doubt a Kia would outbrake it or outcorner it.

 

EXACTLY

It's 100% street legal stock. Kia/Hyundai make more than SUVs. I walk into any dealership and drive it out today. Kia/Hyundai (they are the same exact company) upcoming car, the R20 N will be even faster for goodness sakes.

The claim was a simple one, that a 60's (I assume a stock S3 Elan) will beat "any stock Kia today." I purposely emphasize 'stock', well since any car can be modified to beat any other vehicle, all it takes is money.

A stock 68' S3 Elan will get absolutely destroyed on a track or a 'malibu' canyon with a comparable driver vs a modern-day Stinger. Hell, I'll even grant you the 70's "Sprint" model with 120hp (non-emission version) that wasn't even allowed in the US.

***

Also, as I mentioned before, KIA bought the rights to the Gen 2 Elan ironically enough, and The House of Chapman is now owned by the Chinese. I simply mention the Communist party since they are not shy about 'borrowing' from others.

 

Funny you should mention the Stinger - a very impressive car. I came up against one (modified for track use) in my Elan (also modified) at Bathurst. Acceleration pretty much identical, but my brakes were way better, and I could easily drive around him on the corners. But leaving aside turbocharged halo models, a standard Elan will hold its own pretty well. And with some very minor mods, the Elan becomes a giant killer. Apart from a high-speed circuit, I doubt an F355 could knock mine off - it would be pretty close.

 

Folks that hate EVs fall into 2 camps.
1) For subjective qualitative reasons
2) For P&R

I understand and respect #1 from folks that don't whinge about the newer models.
Why? I simply think the true 'ethos buster' is if new Ferrari cars go slower than previous ones. For that simple fact, I'm branded.

I've addressed #2 ad Infinitum.

 

Of course, many dedicated track cars can destroy more powerful street cars. That's not exactly news for folks that track.

I have no reason to doubt your exploits on the track. Modifying a car, however, is not limited to just Lotus (or any single manufacturer.)

I mean, who doesn't derive some satisfaction when a person shows up claiming their car is the 'best' able to beat anything from another manufacturer. only to be embarrassed on track.

I certainly do.

 

As much as we share a love for high-performance vehicles, I'm not going to deny that the overwhelming majority of people are perfectly content with a Toyota Camry.

Besides, where are US states not allowed to set their own policy when it comes to ICE banning or not?

If you're upset that companies won't cater to certain states only, well - anyone can start a new company to do just that (I'm sure that is exactly what will happen.)

I'm not supportive of FORCING companies doing things that may go against their bottom line.

 

I remember the first Plasma TV I bought was $10,000 That was with an employee discount when I was working at Vivendi Universal (partnered with Panasonic at the time)

It's sitting in some dumpster today.

Some folks forget really quickly.

 

Problem is Ferrari can’t get by with being slower than everyone’s commuter cars. Carburetors went away because, even if they sound good, they’re actually not good compared to modern or even old modern fuel delivery systems. (Mercedes was using mechanical injection in the 1950s…) ICE technology is headed the same way.


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