The end of Ferrari, as we know it

Then don't buy it.

EZPZ.

I mean, some dude here also wanted to stay with incandescent bulbs. He probably also has a rotary phone sitting on top of a 1986 phone book and uses a washing board in the river. Who am I to judge if somebody wants to use a monocle instead of glasses, wears a cape, and carries a cane around for fashion.

Doesn't affect me. Enjoy!

But when those same people come here and claim the objective audio superiority of an 8-track over more modern mediums...yeah, I'll say what a few of us are thinking.

 

BAM.

Exactamundo.

Some guy that got mad at me on this thread posted a 'car graveyard' of brands - ironically, he didn't realize they all went bankrupt because they did exactly what he is pining for: Staying the same while the world moved on.

I know I'm a broken record, but I just never thought I would see so many people proposing newer Ferrari go slower (on a Ferrari enthusiast site no less!)

There's a stereotype that Ferrari owners are all performance 'poseurs.' It's surprising to me that some would rush to embrace the generalization for the latest cars.

 

Cognitive dissonance at play.
**
Ferrari at its core, at its very center, is winning races.
Can we all agree there?

I'm not saying that is what Ferrari means to *you* - I'm saying that's what Enzo cared about.
**
Last I checked winning races means being the best performing car with the most talented driver.

Sound, vibration, smell, looks, or what you ate in the paddock were secondary to winning.

Time traps certainly didn't get affected by who you voted for that morning.
***
Now we have folks whinging that Ferrari's latest cars are too fast...and we're the ones that 'lost our way?"

Holy smokes the world is so backwards right now,

 

I recall a ruling recently saying California's stupidity violated the Commerce Clause. I might be wrong.

 

I have been putting a design on paper for a supplemental energy system for hydroponics and it is similar to this. Energy acquisition and storage using LiFe battery packs. Working on ROI at the moment to justify.

 

Paul, you are passionate about this. More power to you. Frankly, I could less. Ferrari could go bankrupt tomorrow, and I wouldn't shed a tear. I don't care if they build nothing but electric SUVs.

 

I think it really depends upon how they are using the system. For the system I am paper designing at the moment for hydroponics by supplementation of energy from a panel and battery setup, I have to derate the incoming power from the panels by 50% and then have a maximum battery drain of 50% to give a 12 year life to the LiFe battery. That would give me a 25% efficiency of the panel system. Therefore, a 40kw panel setup would deliver 10kw of power to the hydroponics needs.

I did some math on the 20kw of LiFe battery setup months ago and calculated the charge time for the 20kw battery setup and it takes more time than people realize. This means that ROI for EV’s based upon a solar panel setup can be quite substantial for certain parts of the country. This may not be a problem though for people that drive less than 50 miles per day since the recharge time and energy would be much less.

 

I just want my place to be able to function off grid if the county power goes out. All the panels would have to do is keep the backup battery charged. I don't have an EV.

 

If ICE technology is purely based on power, performance and consumption then we should have caved in to EVs a long time ago, most if not all Ferraris will soon be slower than your i3, Leaf, or Tesla plaid given the instant gearless acceleration

Understand it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't argument but I for one sure wish Ferrari would recognize performance, speed, power is now dwindling to a zero sum game... Sure they are building the hybrids and soon EVs that will be .1 second faster, .2 seconds faster, but I do not like the trade-offs and costs for more weight, more complexity, less noise, less emotions to gain 0-60 sub 3 seconds, 800hp+ all on public roads that don't have increasing speed limits

Gov regulations might sure well be forcing them into this (sad), but I admire what Porsche has at least held out doing giving their fans a NA lightweight manual still and look at the line out the door of customers waiting to purchase one. The new one has what, 10 hp more than the last one? Near identical performance to the model it's replacing?

I guess the problem is how Ferrari is still selling every single one of it's units, pre-sold, for next 3+ years allegedly so what do I know. Their customers are still accepting what Ferrari has to bring to market..

But IMO I abide by what Enzo said that the Ferrari is the engine and you get everything else for free, I don't see how that ethos will stay with Ferrari when everything is outsourced and easily replicated battery packs

 

The battery technology we have now is comparable to Windows 1.0. Lithium batteries was as big a game changer to Lead Acid as Windows was to DOS, but we have not seen IOS or even smartphones yet of the battery technology. The performance of the EV cars has been the focus because that would sell the cars and it was 'easy', Energy storage and weight are the next two areas where huge progress will be made over the next decade. This combined with the inherent low center of gravity of the EVs will make fun and nimble cars.

And where do you see more complexity with EVs over a modern ICE? It can literately not be more simple even in the high performance EVs

 

I guess I should have been more clear that the hybridization of a Ferrari makes it more complex, than a modern ICE without it. All for what? Maybe 2 mpg better, 30 miles of range, 0.3 seconds off 0-60, and a greater top speed I'll never see? CO2 emissions? Now you have to still do your regular service, spark plugs and oil changes, but you also now have a battery pack/e-motor system + more software to manage and harmonize the entire thing to keep running over the lifespan of the car....

And when we get to a pure Ferrari EV (no more ICE!!), it sure is less complex I'll concede, but I don't know if that's any better because when we get to that point I really don't know what separates a Ferrari EV to the Pininfarina Battista, Lotus Evija, or the 500+ other 1500HP EV supercars slated to come out in the near future other than your subjective opinion about design. Blindfold yourself as a passenger in the now dead silent instant thrust experience, and tell me what car you're in as you smell the vegan faux leatherette and tape the probes to your head so that you can now telepathically tell the car where to set its autopilot

I don't doubt that there will be more progress made for EVs, at all. Noting even Porsche is doing the GT4-EV and soon converting the Cayman line into their attempt at nimble EVs as a sportscar. I've toured the Taycan factory in Zuffenhausen which looks like the Death Star compared to the more primitive lines on the 718/911 side. Going from Windows 1.0 to iOS Dolomites won't bring me a screaming flat plane crank V8 or V12, with a gearbox that will turn your car into Pavarotti as you see fit. That's a defining characteristic for what makes Ferrari, Ferrari

I'm sure we can attribute it to many things, but have you seen Formula"E" compared to Formula 1? I would rather do anything I can with my own 2 bare hands from beach trash cleanup to planting trees to make the world a better place than watch 10 minutes of FormulaE

 

Agree, hybridization makes no sense at all.

FormulaE is a wrong format, don't know who came up with that. Have you seen Extreme E?

 

I'd never buy an electric Ferrari. I'll wait and sell my two gas cars.

 

Well done, everything is very well summed up !!!

 

Well said


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I’m no greenie pushing for not yet ready for prime time technology to save the earth but this looks promising to make EVs a more reasonable alternative to ICE both in power density, weight and charging times:

https://www.thebrighterside.news/post/first-commercially-viable-lithium-metal-battery-solid-state-charges-in-just-15-minutes

I’m sure it won’t be commercially available for another decade


Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat

 

I think you mean never, Quantumscape will likely be out of business well before 10 years occurs...

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Quantumscape
2m04s -4m00s

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2022/06/15/quantumscape-stock-hits-new-low-after-exec-exit.html

 

and, the CFO is dumping 10% of their shares every month, unless there is another options award, they will of sold all their stock by next April...

 

This looks like a post I made about Tesla 10 years ago ... I was proven wrong, maybe you will be proven right, but I hope not. I hope that JB Straubel is right about them and that VW and Bill Gates will stay the course as some of the major investors

 

Take this as you will:

https://www.westernjournal.com/journalists-tow-camper-behind-electric-truck-end-stunning-failure-make-85-miles/

 

Towing ability on a Ferrari forum - really

I would have expected this:

 

They should of use a Diesel pickup for comparison, it has much better range and, they should of loaded the trailers with a car!! I wonder what that 85 mile range would become with a loaded trailer, 40 miles?

 

A Model X Plaid would properly beat your Ferrari on the 1/4 mile and afterwards tow your Ferrari home to you ;-)

But if you are so much into tow bars, there is no reason drive a pick-up

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It's interesting to me to note the title, the trends of where these arrows are going, and how the older + slower 458 & F12 are the most appealing to me out of all depicted on pure driving experience (not value, not Fiorano lap time)

Imagine being able to spec a 458 or F12 new now, versus 296/SF90/Roma...

 

That’s why I would be the first to cry and yell in the streets if vintage Ferrari are ever banned. Thankfully that notion is a straw man if there ever was one. The reasons for the setting up of that false edifice is the more interesting notion to me.