Charred "W" Connector Repair Kits

good work Alden

 

How would this be an issue with the fuse box? It's clearly a week connector that caused the heat problem.

Your stronger connector should solve the problem. Where did you buy your terminals?

 

It is an issue with the fuse box because it was designed and built with male and female connectors not capable of handling, on a long term basis, the current loads of the fuel pumps, cooling fans or air conditioning system. The overheating of the connector transmits heat to the very fragile PC boards inside and damages them too.

Improving the female end is a good improvement but not a true fix in the opinion of most of us that have been dealing with the problem since the early 80's when they started using that design.

 

Old thread but I thought I'd try...How do you unpin the stock connectors from the W connector and the other large flat white connectors that go to the fuse box? Thanks

 

It's not rocket science :
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Thanks Steve - I've unpinned a ton of molex and deutsch connectors but for some reason I couldn't get these. I also posted separately on the Mondial forum (https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/fuse-box-help-from-guido-or-other-elect-experts.663477/) about a few wires added to that W connector, patching off the brown wire and the green wire - I included pictures and would appreciate any insights on whether I should simply re-do those wires as they were or eliminate them - Joe

 

The fix is to rebuild the fuseboxes. Then take high current load like cooling fans off the fusebox. Use the ferrari oem system to energise a remote relay properly sized to handle appropriate loads.

 

Yes, I saw your other thread and then immediately got discouraged when I found that the relay positions shown in the euro Mondial QV wiring diagram don't match the relay positions shown in the euro Mondial 241/82 OM. Based on the number of terminals on each relay in your photo, my guess is that the euro Mondial QV 241/82 OM is correct -- can you check this point? (They also did a terrible job in the euro Mondial QV wiring diagram not showing/not keeping the relays in the schematics where they actually are located on the fuse-relay panel -- doesn't make things easy).

 

Sorry Steve, I am a little confused as there were no pics of my relays in the post, just a shot of the W connector with wires scabbed onto the brown and green wire as well as a pic of the back of my fuse box (where the brown wire on the W connector is attached to) and a pic of the molex connector in the driver side of the cockpit (where the green wire from the W connector is attached to the yellow wire in the molex)....None of this looks factory but I can't be sure.

As for the owners manual, the only OM I have been able to get is one for an Australian delivered car so I am not sure what you want me to check. If it helps, my car # is 55507. I have a QV euro wiring diagram and bought a colored 308 QV wiring diagram from another poster but neither is that much help. Thanks for weighing in on this - Joe

 

Your picture of the back of the fuse-relay panel shows the locations and number of terminals for some of the relays, and this jpeg describes why I think that the euro Mondial QV wiring diagram is wrong for the relays and the 241/82 OM may be right for the relays:

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It certainly isn't "factory" The relay in the red circle with the added wire, I think, is the fuel pump relay so some sort of "fix" applied there -- i.e., the added black wire connects the output 87 terminal of the fuel pump relay directly to the large beige wire of the w connector going to the fuel pump (it takes the w connector terminal out of the picture), and the other modification at the green wires connecting to the yellow wire, I think, has something to do with "fixing" an ignition switch problem -- the green wires are supplying a key-switched +12V to the yellow wire(s) that go to the ignition coils and/or Digiplex ECUs (and it's the ignition switch that should be doing this). However, I think that you may have some other modification -- looks like a small A (light blue) wire is missing (or has been relocated) or has broken off from the w connector. Help me confirm/deny what's going on with the relays, and we'll go from there.

This link will get you a pdf copy of the 241/82 euro OM for you car:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ne0nkw3snudfp9/MUM_MondialQuattroValvole 241_82.pdf?dl=0

On pages 101-103, the relays are labeled by letter and then the Bosch part number is given for each relay letter -- please check if the Bosch part numbers on your relays match the locations/pattern in the 241/82 OM, or not.

 

Big help and much appreciated...It also makes me think that some of the Bosch relays that I bought (10 of the 0332019151, 7 of the 0332209151 and one of the 0332015006) might not be right?

My fuse box is at my garage so I will get it later this week and can get more pictures. As for the light blue wire, isn't it in the picture at the bottom of the W connector?

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To me, there is no wire on position 10 on that picture.

 

Now I see what you mean - Is there a chance that the light blue wire with the green wire in position 9 is supposed to be in position 10? I need to do some studying of what you and Steve have provided and get my fuse box in front of me so maybe this can be figured out. You and Steve have already been a big help and I know this is a difficult thing to try to diagnose electrical matters from a few pics and posts - I'll be back later this week with more info - Joe

 

Those are OK, but you'll have to do a translation:
0332014113 (metal case) = 0332019151 (black plastic case)
0332204101 (metal case) = 0332209151 (black plastic case)

Yes, the wiring diagram shows that the small A (light blue) wire should be in that vacant position next to the green wires. Has it been connected to the green wires, or is the (broken) end just happening to look like it? If it has been connected to the green wires (to "steal" +12V from the green wires when the key is "on") = another sign that there's something wrong with the ignition switch as that small A wire should be +12V from the ignition switch terminal 15 when the key is "on".

 

Steve - I will examine the W connector more closely when I am at my garage and will report back on the light blue wire. However, I cleaned the entire front harness when I had it out of the car and other than the things that I pointed out on the W connector, everything was in good shape...I still have the steering column out so if the ignition switch needs to be dealt with, its fairly easy to get to. When I was cleaning up the steering column and going over its wiring, nothing seemed to be messed with...

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I think that picture is fooling us....that blue wire is going to 10 but its pushed up.

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Here you find the internal diagram for QV and 3.2. Its the back side of your board and split in 2 for more clearness.
If in some stage of the car, a owner put an extra wire between relais t and v (left side of diagram) than he was thinking for extra juice for the fuel pump. Not only with a fuse, but also without fuse direct current from battery. Why using fuses, when you can get current directly to the fuel pump, they must have thinking.

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Thanks Guido - in addition to being an electronics genius, you are also a very good detective - Here's the pic of the W connector again but blown up and as you noted, the light blue wire is in the #10 position and is just pulled away toward the green wire.

I haven't been able to get to the garage yet to grab the fuse box but will do so later this week and in the meantime, can study these diagrams of the back of the box. Then I will also do the tests in post #4 of my original thread about these mystery "alterations" (https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/fuse-box-help-from-guido-or-other-elect-experts.663477/)

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I have the fuse box with me now and did the tests with the multi-meter that Guido suggested. I listed these tests as #1-3 below and put the responses in bold:

1) I would test first if there is direct contact between fuse 21 and upper connector 30 of middle relais - There is direct contact (connectivity) between fuse 21 (labeled A16 Fuel Pump) and upper connector 30 of middle relais

2) Then test if you have direct contact between upper connector 30 of the left relais and 1 of the big + connectors on your board - There is direct contact (connectivity) between upper connector 30 of the left relais and the big + connectors on my board (the left one)

3) Check if there is direct contact between lower connector middle relais and pin 8 - There is direct contact (connectivity) between lower connector middle relais and pin 7 in the W connector (counting the pins from the top)

As you'll see in the photo below of the front of the fuse box, the fuse was missing from fuse 21 (labeled A16 Fuel Pump) and the bottom of the fuse holder is very slightly melted. Please let me know what you think and if it will be OK to cut the short white wire on the back of the fuse box and the black wire on the back of the fuse box and repair the wires on the W connector and basically return it to stock or if I should try some other tests. Thanks again for all the help on this - Joe

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Joe, so here is my opinion on this FB =
With the old style fuses it will be always a problematic situation. Messing around will make thing worse. An OEM board cannot be repaired. Solder points coming loose, re-soldering will burn the plastic layers...we all are confronted with this problem. That is why I started to make my own board 15 years ago.
There are some solutions on the marked, but I'm not allowed to make remarks on "who" or "where". You can always start a private conversation for more information.

 

Thanks - Given the results of the three tests that you suggested I am inclined to go forward and remove the added wires and give it a try. One question for you...you said to check if there is direct contact between lower connector middle relais and pin 8 and as I noted, there is direct contact (connectivity) between the lower connector middle relais and pin 7 (not 8) in the W connector (counting the pins from the top). Did you mean pin 7 or does this suggest that there is another issue?

I have inspected all the wiring in the car, most of which is in great shape with the exception of a few wires that were exposed to heat and grit in the engine compartment which i am cleaning up. My guess is that there was a fuel pump problem and rather than changing the fuel pump, someone thought it better to override the fuse to get direct current to the fuel pump...?

 

+googol!

I didn't even know that this abomination combination existed. It's like they were in a design meeting, and said: "Let's keep the crappy fuses and replace the reliable hardwiring with a crappy PCB -- yeah, that will be great" . I thought all of the more modern combination fuse-relay panels, at least, had the much better ATO/ATC fuses. There's no decision needed here -- get something that uses the ATO/ATC blade fuses as Guido suggested.

 

Me wrong...yes pin 7 goes to lower contact of that relais. Pin 8 goes to the lower connector of the relais next to it.
You can try as temporary solution to go with this board....just temporary. But do not blame me when its going to be hot...or burning !