LaFerrari replacement: v12, no hybrid, less power than SF90stradale?

They also said they wouldn't build an SUV.

 

Unlike Enzo that put so much of the profits back into Ferrari for Racing etc the currents share holders want to fill there pockets. So what was once not an option is now wide open if the $$$ are there, sadly.

 

It's not really an SUV, rather a jacked up Lusso. At any rate, a street legalised 499P would be too compromised as a road car, hence their statement.

In F1 there is a budget cap and Ferrari have also entered the WEC in the big category with the 499P, whilst also racing the 296 and the 488. Their racing programme is bigger than ever. What else would you like them to do?

 

Stop thinking then, it's clearly not working.

The Laferrari weighs roughly 1600 kg, while the Enzo weighs roughly 1500 kg. Both are porkers.
Especially if you compare them to a T50, which weighs less than a ton.
Take the hibryd system out of the equation and the LaFerrari still has an extra 400 kg on the T50.
So what makes it so much heavier, where does all the extra weight come from ?!??
Are Ferrari engineers so damn stupid compared to those from a small company such as GMA ?!???

It cannot feel good when it's a porker.

 

Easy one to answer, Gordan Murray is obsessive about weight and designs are optimised, and suspect no marketing dept that generally add mass on perceived customer demands.

 

Firstly I know all that. I also know that with the F1 budget cap means those $$$ could easily fund the other racing programs. So all this extra $$$ from there SUVs etc are going where ??? into pockets instead of growing the company, its products etc. I have no issues with them making money but the amount going in to pockets seem to be a hell of alot.

 

The GMA T.50 is more than 1 ton and it is not "street legal" in USA, that means it has less weight due to not having to comply (they say mostly due to central seating position, but GMA knew it would pass so they likely also took other shortcuts that work for Europe but not for USA).

The GMA T.33 has a dry weight of "2400" pounds, meaning it is likely well over 2600 pounds "all in".

 

Ferrari could take the same route for their HALO car for the European market.
USA rules are garbage.

I was talking about the T50, not T33. But even taking the second as reference and assuming your calculations are right, 2600 pounds is roughly 1180 kg, that's still way way lighter than an Enzo or a LAFerrari.
A 1200 kg Ferrari HALO hypercar would be awesome. Even 1300 kg would still be great.

 

T.50 is much smaller than Laferrari
35 cm shorter, 15 narrower which is a lot.
Also engine is smaller, hence lighter,
tyres also smaller,
hybrid is ~150kg,
and, yes it is true, Ferrari don't care about weight as they use to,
as someone said here,
they are now more luxury brand than sporty one.
But it is sooooo nicer, and i just looooove it.
The next one will be even better.
I hope lighter , at least some benefit for having half the engine from older brother .

 

Into R&D. Ferrari has one of the largest R&D investment percentages over profits of any company, not just car companies! The Purosangue is not going to be made in huge numbers anyway, just 20% of overall production.

Certainly not for your story...

The LaFerrari has been weighed at around 1570 with a full tank. That makes it around 1370 dry. The T50 claims about one tonne, dry. So the difference you are talking about is without the hybrid system. Taking the hybrid into account, the difference would be less than 200 kilos. This difference is easily attributed to the larger physical size of the Ferrari, its larger engine, better amenities and the fact that its technology is already 10 years old. Now let's wait and see how the T50 compares when it gets tested.

Nobody who has even driven it has said that a LaFerrari feels heavy. Everybody said that it feels like a 1000 HP 458 Speciale!!! Do you know the word "dogmatic". If not, look it up...

 

The LaF most definitely doesn’t feel heavy. I am also very impressed by the feel of the SP3. If anything it is even more sorted as a car and if anything feels lighter than the LaF


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No wonder the SP3 feels lighter, because in fact it should be lighter, lacking the hybrid-electric components that are present on LaFerrari. But still, hybrid LaF is faster and yet does not feel heavy.

Both options win, but it's easier to add more performance by adding electric motor(s) etc. (weight), than to improve it by solely losing the car weight.

 

We would love to hear about how your first impression about the SP3 in the dedicated thread.

 

The SP3 is in fact heavier than the LaFerrari

 

Then you should not see any logical reason why it feels lighter to the driver.

The factory states, the SP3 kerb weight is 1485kg vs LaFerrari Aperta 1585kg. Hybrid system components equal to ~140kg on the LaF. So that 100kg difference would make sense.

 

Ferrari quotes 1485 dry weight for the SP3, whilst they have not released a weight figure for the LaFerrari. The LaFerrari has been weighed at around 1570 with a full tank though, which would make it lighter than the SP3 with fluids. Not that it matters. All that matters is how they drive.

 

Do you think the LaFerrari successor will use the Multimatic TrueActive Spool Valve Damper or the more traditional damper?

 

Confession:I have not been following this thread but given the imminent SF90 VS launch I find it very difficult to see how Ferrari can create a hypercar that sits a long way above SF90VS in performance terms especially given the limiting factor of tyre technology.
If they can it will be one hell of an achievement.

 

Just the carbon fibre "tub" and a TT V6 instead of the TT V8 can make a weight difference that will translate into better car-dynamics. More power (hybrid V6TT) and less weight means it has to be faster.
Traction is going to be AWD so the performance won't be limited by tyres as much.

The press using kerb and dry weight interchangeably is sometimes giving a headache. I'd take the 1485 and 1585 kg as kerb for real.

Just cannot imagine how a car (SP3) built on more or less the same carbon tub as the LaF Aperta, using carbon fibre panels, carbon fibre doors, fixed carbon seats etc, and having no hybrid-electrical components (around 140kg ) or active aero trickery mechanism, can still weigh more than the LaFerrari.
A driver's impression is also that SP3 feels lighter than the LaF.
Not that it makes any difference to the question over the upcoming hypercar.
Typically for Ferrari, the real weight will stay a mystery long after the car's debut.

 

Ferrari's official website quotes 1485 dry for the SP3, whilst not offering any weight figure for the LaFerrari. The LaFerrari has been weighed in at 1570 with a full tank.

All these slats and rakes, I guess... LOL!

 

The secret of the feeling of lightness is to be found in the level of the calibration of the direction since the F12.
To feel the real weight of a car behind the wheel, nothing better than very hard braking on a winding road... It is in these circumstances that you feel the weight of the SF 90 the most, and it is probably in the same way that we will feel the weight of VS.
The speeds of passage in curve, on tracks, between 173VS and 250 are very different... nothing more normal, the inertia remains the inertia... even with all the artifices to erase it...

 

Huge weight difference between the two ?

 

Yet the SF90 brakes better than the F8, even though the latter is 200 kilos lighter. It's all about the engineering and the application, not a weight number.

 

the sf90vs will be a little further off the brick wall limit of tyres I think - the aston valk with it's extreme focus, aero etc laps faster than a p1 gtr on road tires and from what i've been told the tires on the valk are the biggest factor in stopping it from going even faster, nothing road legal simply exists at the moment which can handle what the valk can give it

 

The Valkyrie is a beast. It reached 325 kph on the pit straight of the Bahrain GP circuit.