Is the 911 market affected by generational shift?

I tend to agree with this. Basic air-cooled 911s are not that complicated, and anyone who is a good mechanic can work on them. As I mentioned, the guy working on my 75 911S is my vintage Mercedes guy. He's a solid mechanic and has owned an air cooled 911 himself in the past, so it's all easy for him. I wouldn't ask him to rebuild the motor or anything, but for basic stuff he's great.

Air cooled 911s would be the last cars I would worry about (well, along with American V-8s from the 50s-70s) from this point of view.

The other thing is, there are a ton of air cooled 911s around, because they last forever. So there is no shortage of work for those guys, which keeps people coming into the field. I would guess within 20 miles of me there are probably 15-20 shops capable of working on an air cooled 911, and probably 5-10 of them would consider themselves specialists.

 

With the coming planned wave of Porsche EVs, I’d go even further: The service and repair revenue from EVs is comparatively small, so the Porsche Classic program isn’t just nostalgia and goodwill. There’s good money to be made in keeping old air-cooled 911s on the road. If Porsche doesn’t make a part, they either resume production (and note this in their Porsche Classic vol 1-8 books) or find a source.

I’d agree that old 911s are in a unique spot, because the operating costs aren’t anywhere near what a contemporary Aston, Ferrari or Lamborghini demands, and unlike a Lotus you can expect a level of reliability that makes it a reasonable purchase to many, including younger guys who appreciate classic sports cars but aren’t up for exotic service bills. With air-cooled effectively replaced after 1998, the old 911s actually are starting to seem exotic.


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I think the guy in the video makes some good points about very specific examples that it’s best to avoid paying a premium for. There are, however, a few things that come along with some of his predictions that I think will help keep interest and sales strong.

One thing, perhaps the most important, though it pains me to admit it - you simply cannot understate how YouTube culture affects everything. There are an awful lot of young influencers with very strong followings who are 10-15 years my junior. Their opinions are certainly playing a part in the market.

The demise of the manual is something that I think will keep values up as well. I’m think it is even quite possible that some will find charm in things like the older F1 systems that have a bit of a learning curve and technique requirement.

Using myself as an example - while I grew up being attracted to the MARQUES I have purchased, my desires have shifted drastically with regard to models. I’m fact, many of the cars I really want that, sadly, remain well out of reach financially, were made well before I was even a thought. So the enthusiast element can’t be ignored either.

 

I meant “overstate”. Carry on…

 

When it comes to 911’s, newer, with a stick, is generally better. You can’t say the same about Ferraris.


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Interesting... depends on what you mean by "better." I would argue that the current Ferraris are pretty darn good, and better than what came before-- if by "better" you mean faster and more usable.

However, as they all start to go to electric and hybrid, I have to agree with you. Not sure Porsche is any better than Ferrari in that regard.

 

As donv posted, it depends on what you mean by “better”.

If I had to list my most memorable drives, I’d have to include a 1973.5 911T and a 1962 356B. Not fast, but a feast for the senses. Would I take either of those over a 992 three pedal manual? ….

Yes.

But the point of the thread was that I could step back into Porsche history and immediately felt at home.


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I honestly don’t think the 911, at least up to the 997, will ever be forgotten. I don’t think the current insanity can last, but then again, I didn’t think it would survive the rate hikes, etc. When the pandemic began I thought, “Well, my garage just lost its value.” Clearly…I was not correct.

The only certainty is uncertainty, but the 911s flight path is undeniable and transcends generational concerns. There are still people like me who came of age during the 997 gen and we have a lot of car buying years ahead of us.

 

I have owned nine Porsche 911's (1969-2023). I had a lot of fun with the older air-cooled cars (six of them).

I only have one now and enjoy the comfort and reliability. The bluetooth and A/C is great. And the newer cars are faster with better brakes. I am getting old.
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I have found that for driving fun, without built in biases, the newest plain Jane 911 is better than those that came before it, regardless of year. Clearly, a new 911 is not a vintage experience. If that’s what you want, get an old car. But for all out fun, newer is better.


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Spot on. Porsche engineering can’t be beat.


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I understand. I owned a 1973.5 with 18k miles. Great car. I sold it because it didn’t have a/c. It gets hot in Texas.


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For $50,000, a car like this is great fun. It might not attract too many strippers, but maybe that is a good thing.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2010-porsche-911-carrera-coupe-9/

 

It's too late for that $50K Carrera. If BAT sells it, they go to another one which causes delays on posting.

I know how to adjust the values on an early car. It has to be done every 2500-5000 miles. It takes a new oil change every 5000 miles (8 quarts)

There are no worries on A/C issues as it will never work well. I drove three cars for 200K+ miles over 30 years.

I worked with good mechanics back then. They are all retired now so YouTube is your friend today, I am sure all of you will master the older issues very quickly.

 

pleeeze, The IMS bearing says 'Hold my beer'
.

 

Gone after 2009.

 

yeah, but still Porsche engineered. The myth of 'German engineering' is a glass house. Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW ....... all have infamous failures of engineering/reliability.
.

 

I'll admit the IMS problem was weird. What I was referring to is taking a rear-engine car and doing wonders. By all rights, the 356 should have been the last rear engine.

Moreover, looking at Ferrari can you truly say each new generation is better than the last? I can see 348-360-430-458, but that's it. Frankly, I doubt I'll buy another Ferrari again because at 70 I want less complications in my life. But if I did, I certainly wouldn't buy any of the new cars.

 

Heck, Porsche also had to head bolts pulled out from 1974-1979. Bottom line is that everyone knows it.

I'd say that Porsche cars are second to Ferrari as to older cars still owned and driven. No one sends them to a junk yard.

 

Honestly, not much to worry about after mid-‘06…

 

Still, I could have a lot of fun driving this car.

 

Yes, we all could enjoy driving it. It's the maintenance of the car that needs a lot of dedication.

 

I’m a CPA. My toolbox is a checkbook. The sight of me with a wrench in my hand is scary. [emoji41]


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Maybe Ferraris have ruined my perspective, but maintenance concerns on a 2010 911? No IMS, bore scoring is extremely unlikely, mileage on that car isn’t exceptionally high…what am I missing?

 

Adding to that, I've had a 997.2 motor pushing me around in some form or fashion since 2015. My cars have been daily driven, autocrossed, tracked, and road-tripped. Outside of routine maintenance, they've required nothing special.