Potential New Owner Questions

Hello forum,

I am a potential prospective buyer who has been following this forum for a few months. I have watched all the youtube content and read all the reviews out there. I’m pretty familiar with the car on the technical front but I’m not sure how the car drives.

I like smaller, lighter cars and maybe this statement will disqualify me from ever owning this car. I currently own a 991.2 GT3RS and I used to own a 992 TTS and C7 ZR1 (manual). My TTS is slightly bigger car weighing 3600 lbs vs 3200 lbs of the RS. ZR1 had the same weight. Both of these cars didnt work for me due to laws od physics not favoring them. Pushing them into corners you could absolutely tell the weight.

That being said, I am a sucker for N/A engines. The sound and the throttle response for me have a much higher weight than the toss-able aspect of the car.

Given the above, my first question is does anyone actually know how much a common spec 812 superfast weigh wet with full tank of gas and fluids?

I have seen numbers as low as 3600 lbs and as high as 3900 lbs.

The other question is I love Porsche steering. How communicative it is. You can close your eyes and the steering wheel literally will transmit tactile feedback. I hated the corvette steering. It was quick but numb. I hated the F90 M5 steering more, very numb. Where is the 812 sf steering in all of this?

 

I don’t have an 812 but have an F12. I also have a 991 GT3. IMO the steering of the Ferrari can’t touch the GT3 but it is pretty good for a GT car. I also used to have an F90 M5 and I hated that steering more than any car I have ever owned. It was numb and digital and horrible, the F12 is way better than that.

 

How do you find the other dynamic aspects of GT3 vs F12? Cornering, braking, under or over steering, etc.

Also, how is the overall durability of the car? Porsches have this vault like feel to them that you cant break them.

 

Welcome to the forum but you’re in the wrong one.

If you want the Ferrari that’s like your Porsche with 6 cylinders and an engine behind you, then you should take a look at the 296GTB forum.

Trying to compare a 911 to an F12 is futile and pointless. Different tools for different purposes.

There is a very good case to be made for owning both.

 

I am looking for an “every drive is an event” car. I dont like lamborghini or mclaren (too aggressive styling). But I am not looking for a too comfortable cruiser. This was the problem I had with Turbo S. A lot of people said “you should own both” or “totally different cars” yet it was such a boring, dull car. I love an E92 M3, I hated the F10 M5. I loved a GT350 but I hated C7 ZR1. I love GT3/RS and hated TTS. I realize with time it has to be naturally aspiration and sound that makes me either keep or sell a car. Throttle response is something I never liked in the vette or turbo s. GT3RS is like a sock you wear custom made for you. The way it dances around is unreal.

I personally do not like the V8 sound 458 makes. It doesnt have that musicality V12 has or porsche’s flat 6. The tone changes in my GT3RS as revs climb, so it does in V12 in 812. But this isnt the case in 458 (or the C8 Z06).

I wish there was a naturally aspirated V12 smaller car with potentially engine in the back that didnt have the looks of a car that a 12 year old drew with a ruler (aventedor) or didnt cost a million dollars.

Because of the reasons above, here I am considering 812. What I dont know is how it actually moves around.

I’ll ask again, does anyone know what it weighs? Not ferrari posted weight, but real weight with full tank of gas and all fluids and with floor mats and all. With AC and radio. As how you would spec it.

 

You need a F355 or 360CS in your life.

Every day is an event. Banshee F1 howl from a naturally aspirated V8 and light enough to dance under your fingertips. Take a youtube trip on those to see what I mean.

V12 Ferraris wll give you the sound you’re after but they’re all too heavy for your needs.

There’s a reason that nobody has bothered to weigh their 812s - it’s because nobody cares. It’s heavy. You don’t buy a V12 because you want ‘liight’.

 

Hi,

First of all, for context’s sake, I’ve previously owned a ‘15 Huracan, 720S, manual 991.2 GT3, Bentley GT, and currently own an 812SF and 296GTB.

Second, this is my 812’s weight:
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Third, no the steering isn’t close to the GT3, nor are the brakes or throttle. I’ve especially had a hard time adjusting to the brakes as they are soft compared to the GT3/720S and they bite like 50% in the first 10% of pedal travel.

Steering isn’t dead but you definitely don’t feel everything in the road like the Mclaren or Porsche. It’s also very sensitive and quick. There’s also the rear wheel steer which unlike the GT3 is very noticeable here. It’s jarring, when you’re turning you can press the throttle more and the car turns in more, it’s like the opposite of what should happen.

That being said, I love driving it. I’ve come to realize that road cars are for the road, sure the direct everything in the GT3 is amazing on track but on the street it got me bored (maybe bored is too strong of a word here) after a while. I like having to deal and work around the quirks of the 812 when driving.

Also, the 812 is inherently a GT. It has comfy suspension, comfy seats, a spacious interior with a couple of storage locations, a bench behind the seats, a reasonable boot space. I’ve used it for a few road trips and loved it.

Lastly, an 812 with an aftermarket exhaust is one of, if not the best sounding car ever.

I had both the 812 and GT3 together for almost two years and loved the combination. They compliment each other very well.

PS: I think you’d love a 720/750/765, the steering, pedals, chassis, visibility, ergonomics etc. are all better than the Porsche. It feels like the natural next step. It’s only massive lacking in quality and sound. I do miss my 720, I would’ve kept if not for the million small things that were irking me that I had to fix.

 

Thank you for your post. Your scale says this car weighs over 4,000 lbs. I know the answer but I have to ask because of how high the number is, but are you sure the scale is accurate? This is a lot more than even the highest number I know. Almost as much as an F90 M5.

Thank you, your post is actually extremely helpful. You have touched upon so many things I was trying to find out about.

Unfortunately, once you own a GT3, its like no car ever matches to it in quality, sturdiness, road feel, handling, all the other subjective stuff. Every other car does some things better but then it doesnt do other things well.

I have seen a few mclarens up close and the panel gaps alone (how wide they are and inconsistent) would drive me crazy. I know two people first hand, one 720S other 765LT owner, both have dealt with lots of internal noises and other things like door latches, glass replacing out of warranty. 765LT also had its front dash literally dislocated while driving and became loose. Its like comedy.

Not ruling out the 812 yet but maybe its not all rainbows and sunshine. This is the problem with the youtube videos because a) they are under a lot of subjective pressure by ferrari to not get banned and b) they dont really tell the story about things like quick steering thats not very communicative. My ZR1 had a similar steering, very quick and it would eat corners like you wouldnt believe but it was your eyes visually communicating to you rather than steering wheel telling you whats going on. Knowing how corvette copies ferrari so much, I’m thinking steering character might be similar.

What about mechanical soundness? How durable is the car? Does it visit the dealer often? Oil consumption? Other leaks?

 

I’ve driven a F12 and 812. Owned a a 991 RS for a few years. The Ferrari’s are amazing vehicles.

The Porsche is instrumental in what it’s meant to do. IMO nothing matches the steering and PDK of the GT cars.

That being said nothing sounds like the Ferrari V12…..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Is the sound in 812 mostly noise coming from front of the car (engine/intake/induction) or exhaust?

 

Your first issue is trying to put the 812 into a box that allows you to directly compare it to a GT3. You cannot as they are purpose built for two entirely different things.

I know exactly what you mean when you talk about the qualities of the GT3. The steering is tight, accurate and full of feel with zero dead zone. The seating position is perfect, the pedal position is perfect, the visibility is perfect. It’s all amazing and feels like it’s carved from block of granite and you trust it’s dynamic capabilities inherently.

And that’s where the Ferrari differs. The hood is long and you sit practically on the rear axle sometimes guessing where you are placing the front right tire. But the car makes me giggle like a little girl in ways the GT3 cannot. I know exactly what I’m going to get out of the Porsche and it never surprises me in ways that the big V12 can. It doesn’t ever really leave me breathless or put knots in my stomach the way a 2nd gear pull does in the Ferrari when the rear gets squirrely. And the sound just cannot touch the V12 - the flat six sounds good but sounds tinny in comparison. The V12 sounds like a wall of trumpets and the sound quality is just so unbelievably clear and crisp. Not to mention that the GT3 feels slowwwww in comparison.

To me the idiosyncratic qualities of the Ferrari make it the perfect compliment to a GT3. You really should drive one but make sure you drive it hard.

 

As above...you cannot compare the two. Just yesterday, a good friend of mine in one of our car groups, he owns a 2020 GT3 RS. He has been admiring my 812 since he was it. I took him out for a drive finally. His reaction was priceless. We were high-fiving each other(two 50 yr olds), he was howling and blown away by the sounds, the pulling, and just the overall EXPERIENCE of this car. I capsed the word because that is what it's all about. For reference, I have tracked my 812 a few times, it does need some time to adjust to the driving dynamics, but the rear wheel steering, along with the electronics of this car amazes me how on earth you can put down 800hp on a front-engined rear wheel drive car. It's quite amazing. Do not try to compare it to your P car...there is no way it will compare in the "experience" department. It just feels special.

 

The Ferrari that compares more to a GT3 is a Pista.
Or if you want a newer car, get the 296GTB.
The 812 is a much, much heavier car. As what everyone above already posted, it's a heavy GT car.
However the V12 engine in the 812 is what dictates the entire experience and everything else feels like it's build around that engine.
Not with the Porche where the engine is "just a part"of the car. The V12 IS the car.
The 812 is big and heavy and also feels a bit heavy.
When it starts to move it does shrink and fairly hides it weight, but throw it around tight corners and the weight is there again.
It's an apples vs pears discussion.
Sorry, you can't have your cake and eat it too; make a choice. lol

 

Can’t tell you about the accuracy but my GT3 came in at 1400kg so I don’t have a reason to doubt it.

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In terms of youtube, Savagegeese, Carfection and Throttle house are my go to.

No oil consumption. No leaks. Battery is an issue if you don’t drive it at least once a week (or otherwise plug it in). I’d say it’s pretty reliable overall, nothing like Mclaren.

 

Many thanks for this. I cant really tell what options you have on the 812SF, but are there any options to avoid to reduce the weight on this car? I'd definitely want the lightest seats possible - I am guessing that's an easy 70-75 lbs of savings? But what else?

4020 lbs for a sports car is a lot - but I understand you dont really feel that weight because of RWS and the power the engine makes.

 

Trying to delete options to save of feelable weight is like clipping an elephant's toenails. That won't do anything.
The race seats are rock hard; avoid if you want any kind of comfort.
Or want to make sure your wife/mistress doesn't want to sit in the car with you!

 

As another weight data point, my 812 scaled at 3650lbs at the airport with 1 gallon of gas, but all other fluids. With a full tank it would be roughly 3800lbs, add a driver and you’re right at 4K.

If you want a V12 GT3, you’re spending 7 figures, no standard production car is going to fit into that box. As for an 812, go and drive one and see what you think. I personally love mine, especially after I lowered it a little bit. The handling characteristics are that much better with some springs. The theatrics of the 812 make you feel very alive after you’ve driven it hard. And your passengers will be needing a new pair of shorts.

 

How can you and the other poster have such varying weight figures? Fuel tank being full should mean 60kg or so more but he has got another 125 kg on top of that. What options can add that much weight?

 

I have owned three F12s and one 812 Superfast and sold the 812 SF after 8 months because it was way too heavy and fat (overweight).
I then bought an F12 TDF which is simply sensational, a real lightweight F12 and it fits like a glove.
Forget the 812 SF, it simply has too much "speck" (too fat), no matter how many HP it has.
And try to avoid a car with GPF, because it ruins the emotions.

Marcel Massini

 

wheels, fire extinguisher, rollbar, luggage, etc.

Marcel Massini

 

TDF is out of my price range.

Whats the weight delta between the two?

 

Roll bar in 812?

 

OP, you’re overthinking this.

Just drive the car. If it’s for you then weight ceases to be an issue. If it’s not for you, weight won’t have mattered anyway.

Go drive it and report back.

 

Lightest wheels, no spare wheel or its holder, no roll bar. I’m also surprised. These are my options:
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Which springs? My car is feeling floaty and unstable the last couple of weeks so I might do that.