Hamilton deserves more respect

Seriously..."gave him 103 wins and 7 championships"
C'mon....jeez

 

Yeah, gotta keep up man. That was the "its the car mode".
In 2022 they switched to "Its the driver mode"
If Hamilton wins next year they will switch back to "its the car mode".

 

helped him win 103 races and 7 championships. Happy? It wasn't meant as a jab. The point is he has had the best cars most his entire career. I don't see why he "deserves" more.

 

With no exceptions that I can think of, EVERY multi time WDC had THE BEST CAR.

 

Sorry to say, but I have a strong feeling that with you no dialog is possible on the topic of (Sir) Lewis Hamilton. I guess you mean monologue???

 

Okay. I will take another opportunity to prove a point. By your standard, Hamilton is the GOAT or whatever you want to call him. HE is the reason he has 103 wins, 7 championships, it was more down to him than the car. You have made this very very clear.

Nico Rosberg 2006-2013: 147 races, 3 wins, 4 poles, 11 podiums. Best WDC finish - 6th
Nico Rosberg 2014-2016: 59 races, 20 wins, 26 poles, 46 podiiums. Best WDC finish - 1st, 2nd twice.

Bottas 2013-2016: 78 races, 0 wins, 0 poles, 9 podiums. Best WDC Finish - 4th
Bottas 2017-2021: 101 races, 10 wins, 20 poles, 58 podiums. Best WDC finish - 2nd (twice), 3rd (twice)
Bottas 2022-2023: 36 races, 0 wins, 0 poles, 0 podiums. Best WDC finish - 10th

We can't blame them for having cars not capable of winning in their career. But are we going to pretend that they went from okay drivers with very little success to great drivers with some pretty stunning success all because of skill? Or is it because of the car?

 

That knife cuts BOTH ways, as you well know.

 

Fernando Alonso.

Mic drop

 

I already said that Hamilton should have retired already. 2021 was a watershed in his career,.
His form (and Mercedes) has declined since. You can only stay so long at the top, and it wears you out mentally.
I don't think Hamilton will win a GP again. He still has experience to live on, but his commitment has gone.
He will stay in F1 as long as he is well paid, because F1 is a business now, but the passion has gone, IMO.
When he left Ferrari, I made the same forecast for Alonso who now enjoys an Indian Summer at Aston.

 

I actually think Lewis has stepped up his game. I think he declined in 2017. Not only was he still in the best car, but he no longer had even a teammate to challenge him. Then in 2021 with Max and RBR as a legit challenger, he wasn't able to find a level he once had. In 2022, a fresh George Russell steps into Lewis' team, in a car designed for Lewis and beats the 7x champ. However I think mid 2022 Lewis stepped up his game and was the better of the two till the end of the season, and is outperforming Russell quite badly this season. So Lewis might not be 2008-2016 levels. But I think he's better than the 2017-2021 Lewis.

 

Alonso won 7 GP's (and the WDC) in 2005. Kimi also won 7 GP's that year (and finished 2nd in the WDC). Your stance is that Alonso's 7 wins were through his brilliance and Kimi's were because of the car?
In 2006, Alonso won 7 GP's (and the WDC). Michael also won 7 GP's that year (and finished 2nd in the WDC). Same question as above, except exchange Kimi for Michael

Of note, Alonso's teammate both years (Giancarlo Fisichella) finished 5th and 4th in the final standings. I'm pretty certain NO ONE considers him to be a top flight driver. He won 3 GP's for his 14 year career, 2 of the 3 coming in 2005/2006.

 

Never said Sir Lewis Hamilton was the GOAT, no such thing as goat. I don't have a problem with those stats you post. It's the same for Max. He didn't start breaking records until he got a dominant car. My problem is the ones who say It's Max when he has a dominant car. But switch back to its the car when Sir Lewis Hamilton broke records

 

Factually speaking, the McLaren was the best car in 2005. It was MUCH faster for 75% of the year. Kimi made some mistakes, and there was some reliability issues. Fernando didn't make any mistakes (Imola was unreal under that pressure from MSC), the car was solid, but definitely slower.

In 2006 the Ferrari was the fastest car and for the most part just as reliable. I would say it was the best car. At best for FA, the Renault and Ferrari were even steven, but Alonso did not have the best car that year either. I did an analysis that year and Schumacher should have smoked that championship if things went perfect for him.

You can check the math and data if you don't believe me. I have.

 

^^^
Note I said the BEST car, not the fastest.
They're not the same thing.
A "fast" car that doesn't finish the race is...

 

The 2005 and 2006 seasons were not won by the team with the best car, but the one with the best tyres MICHELIN !
Renault and Mclaren were fitted with Michelin which proved to be better than the Bridgestone Ferrari was equiped with.
Apart from that monumental cock-up at Indianapolis where their clients were instructed NOT to race, Michelin dominated.

 

He won his first race in 2016 without a dominant car. In fact he won 10 races without a dominant car, not even the best car, at times not even 2nd best.

He won 15 races in 2022 without a dominant car. It wasnt even the best car for the first 11 races or so. After Spa you could call it dominant, but not for all of 2022.

So I guess he was breaking records without a dominant car.

 

A slow car that doesn't finish races isn't the best either. I certainly don't qualify a car that is several tenths slower than the fastest as the best car. There was a disadvantage every race. Alonso could not rely on the hope the fastest car was going to DNF, even if there was a 20% probability of it. Honestly, the McLaren (at least Kimi's) didn't DNF as often as it seemed.

 

On 2022, after the first 11 GPs (up to Spielberg), Red Bull won 7 races, plus 2 sprints, had 3 1-2 finishes, and 5 Fastet Laps.
At that point Verstappen was leading the WDC by 38 points and RBR the WCC by 56 points.
After Spa, Verstappen was ahead with 284 pts (Perez 191, Leclerc 186) , and Red Bull too with 118 pts ahead of Ferrari.
If that's not a dominating car; I don't know what it is.

 

Sir Lewis Hamilton won many races without the best car. Nothing new. What records did Max break without a dominant car?

 

Seriously what a tool!

 

Ah, yes I see the need for clarification. What I wanted to say is that I personally dislike seeing great drivers lingering for too long without finding their mojo back: seing someone trying to "make it work" again but failing to do so, then leaving as a has-been always leaves me a sad taste. That's what I meant.
In that sense, when Kimi Räikkonen won in Austin in 2018, I was happy. That last win was deserved, and earned.
Fate would be "unfair and undeserved" to Lewis, should fate fail to provide him with the occasion to score again. Lewis only deserves the occasion to score, but he certainly has to earn the win himself in the end.

Rgds

 

Since you are again insisting on thet "Sir" thing, Lewis Hamilton became Sir Lewis Hamilton on December 30th, 2020.
As "Sir" Lewis Hamilton, he won eight races in total, in 2021. The win before Dec 30th, 2020 were won by Lewis Hamilton.

Rgds

 

My mistake, then. I don't think any driver is more "entitled" to anything than any other driver.
I just hope that fate will be kind enough with him to provide him with the occasion to shine again.
Then, should he get that occasion, it will be entirely up to him to shine again indeed.

Rgds

 

Let's say that, as the post is about SIR Lewis Hamilton, it's not about a President, but the Queen, Her Majesty Elisabeth II?

Rgds

 

I didn't know they were two different people. I stand corrected. Thanks.