original GTSi muffler hinged access to insides? | FerrariChat

original GTSi muffler hinged access to insides?

Discussion in '308/328' started by Du_Man, Jul 13, 2023.

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  1. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    Apr 23, 2003
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    Derek
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    I removed the rear bumper this evening to access the exhaust diaper for removal.... and get access to
    the muffler/exhaust system.
    I noticed these straps on the topside. I swear it looks like you could grind the weld off the 3 straps and lift the flap (which looks to be on a hinge). Can someone school me if this is so?

    I kinda want to keep the original muffler and this looks like a way to expose the muffler insides to address and correct any issues inside the muffler.
     
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  2. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    on a side note, I discovered these crude "catalytic converter airflow cooling tubes.....left one is crushed at the inlet. Never knew about these - Everyday is a school day!
     
  3. ginoBBi512

    ginoBBi512 F1 Rookie
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    I would lose all that "lard" and put in a Tubi and a test pipe. Its such a welcome difference. You have no idea how restrictive and hot running that the factory system runs . I did my 89 23 years ago and never looked back.

    Big G
     
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  4. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    Yes, it's still a path to choose - I think I belong in the camp of not a test pipe - maybe updating the cats, a quieter muffler than the Tubi, and retaining less fuel odor.
     
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  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #5 Steve Magnusson, Jul 14, 2023
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2023
    I doubt removing that would expose the muffler internals as the entire perimeter seam not being fully welded, it would leak exhaust gas. More likely it's just additional heat shielding and there is some insulation material under that "cover" piece (between the cover piece and the actual gas-tight outside case of the muffler) -- but just guessing.
     
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  6. Brian A

    Brian A F1 Rookie

    Dec 21, 2012
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    I have looked at those straps too and have wondered the same thing. It certainly looks like a door. Yeah, the insulation theory makes sense (darn it); there is no sign of gas leakage.

    I need to open up the muffler. I have a rattle in there somewhere.
     
  7. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    I would put money down on your theory......but damn.....where's my grinder.
     
  8. RodC328gts

    RodC328gts Formula Junior

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    Are those “cat cooling tubes” standard? It seems like somebody put them there afterwards.

    I went with the Fabspeed sports cat and a Tubi and I’m really happy. getting rid of the thermonuclear oem cat is a must.
     
  9. RodC328gts

    RodC328gts Formula Junior

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    I remember a thread where somebody open the muffler. It has pictures IIRC
     
  10. RodC328gts

    RodC328gts Formula Junior

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    This is my 328 OEM muffler and to me it only looks like a heat shield cover, that it’s welded on top.
     

    Attached Files:

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  11. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    I am starting to wonder.....I do have an engine with the Theiler riveted badge. I wonder if it could be his custom handiwork.
     
  12. dave80gtsi

    dave80gtsi Formula 3
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    Yes, the 'cat cooling tubes' are indeed factory standard OEM, at least for US spec 2Vi models. I can't speak to any other country nor model year specs.

    Here's the OEM components (first pic) that I removed when I replaced all the bits with an Ansa (second pic). The first picture shows a Stebro muffler that I had at that time, and you can see the noted 'cooling tubes'.

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  13. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    very interesting - I discover more and more as I break the car down. Do you regret not having cats?
     
  14. dave80gtsi

    dave80gtsi Formula 3
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    The shown 'cats' had been gutted by a previous owner sometime in my car's past.
     
  15. bl10

    bl10 Formula Junior

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    Careful about "test pipes" if you live in a state where smog test is required. If we like it or not its coming to most states and the fines are substantial if the smog tech notes modification and classifies it as a "gross polluter" . In Calif, NY and a couple of other states your setting your self up for a world of hurt. I have a friend with a 308 that ended up paying almost 5K including fines to get it through smog.

    Barry
     
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  16. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    Well, the question of the day is what is behind the top 2V muffler shield flap! Steve is correct - it reveals a sheet of nasty fiberglass insulation


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    I opened up the insides to see what was inside - I got a handful of cat honeycomb pieces - but I was pleasantly surprised that the insides just had surface rust.
    I used my DIY vapor-blasting cabinet to clean up the muffler and tips

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    I took off the polished tips - they look to be 60mm/16 gauge SS piping 75mm long

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    Here is the airflow - I can't speak to the restrictive nature of the airflow but it does not look very balanced.......I would think that the right exit tip would get the most exiting gases. I'm unsure how one could improve the restriction without ruining the muffler. I still prefer to clean up this original exhaust system(maybe new free-flow cats) as I look at the bigger picture of getting this 2V back on the road.....maybe restoration round #2, years from now, will include a superior aftermarket exhaust upgrade.





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  17. Basal Skull

    Basal Skull Formula Junior

    Oct 26, 2010
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    View attachment 3649539

    Here is the airflow - I can't speak to the restrictive nature of the airflow but it does not look very balanced.......I would think that the right exit tip would get the most exiting gases. I'm unsure how one could improve the restriction without ruining the muffler. I still prefer to clean up this original exhaust system(maybe new free-flow cats) as I look at the bigger picture of getting this 2V back on the road.....maybe restoration round #2, years from now, will include a superior aftermarket exhaust upgrade.





    [/ATTACH][/QUOTE]

    I would drill holes in the exiting pipe in the chamber that receives the inlet so some of the exhaust bypasses the rest of the muffler

    If you drill holes in the pipe that carries your blue lines - so that some of the gases follows the green lines

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    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
     
  18. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    I would drill holes in the exiting pipe in the chamber that receives the inlet so some of the exhaust bypasses the rest of the muffler

    If you drill holes in the pipe that carries your blue lines - so that some of the gases follows the green lines

    View attachment 3649562




    Thanks! I will give it a study today
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    No and by the way. All that is easily accessed with the bumper in place.
     
  20. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Yes.
     
  21. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Stock from Ferrari.
     
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  22. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    I would drill holes in the exiting pipe in the chamber that receives the inlet so some of the exhaust bypasses the rest of the muffler

    If you drill holes in the pipe that carries your blue lines - so that some of the gases follows the green lines

    View attachment 3649562




    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat[/QUOTE]
    Many rear engine Ferraris from the period had imbalanced flow from the 2 pipes. Dont forget, the higher powered EU versions often had pipe on one side only. Pipes on both sides was done for the sake of appearance, not performance. How many exit pipes do you thing a 180 cubic inch motor needs. Many dyno tests have shown Ferrari mufflers with cats removed to make more power than aftermarket systems. If you want more noise, fine. If you want less weight, fine. If you want more power, save your money.
     
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  23. Imatk

    Imatk Formula Junior

    May 6, 2007
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    What is this DIY vapor blast cabinet you speak of?

    I'm going to "de-rust" my exhaust, and my plan so far is to maybe get a large container and just drop it into some evaporust.

    I did a little sandblasting on the diaper and it was messy as hell so I'm looking for a different solution.
     
  24. Du_Man

    Du_Man Formula Junior
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    I invested in an ultrasonic cleaner that does a good job of cleaning small parts and then wire-wheel to polish and remove stubborn rust. I do use OSPHO for rust-killing. Evaporust is certainly an option.

    Here is my hacked Harborfreight blasting cabinet that will do dry blasting and now will do vapor-blasting (water and glass-bead slurry)......I love it. With the help of YouTube videos, I converted the cabinet to wet so I can blast the aluminum engine panels/plenum to a nice luster. The muffler/exhaust parts really need to be dry media blasted....... especially if I am thinking about cerakoting the exhaust pieces. The rear diaper will not fit in the cabinet but I can get half in at a time and not make too much of a mess. It does take up space, but I have a whole rusty/crusty car to tackle

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    BEFORE
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    AFTER with vapor-blasting
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    Now I want to try my hand at Zinc Plating!
     
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  25. Imatk

    Imatk Formula Junior

    May 6, 2007
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