LOL those flaps are just ridiculous.. makes the "vortex generators" on 812C look incredibly well thought out and elegant actually It's frustrating to me because (again): delete the flaps, allow body color on the rear black stuff, and I'd actually say this is a pretty epic looking car
There are parts of 12 C that try to reincarnate a Ferrari model that many consider epic. Without flaps, possibly with all the black parts painted in the color of the car but certainly with a design idea for the rear part better achieved than the delta wing, IMO perhaps the design of the 12 C could aspire, not to be epic, but to be more coherent.
They work parallel, not independently. Come out with 60 km/h, go down with 280 km/h. The created downforce is less than the downforce created by the flap on the Roma. So for me it is complete nonsense, esp. on a GT car. And the look is horrible.
Flaps don't rise automatically at 60 km/h. They rise only when speed is 60 - 300 km/h AND lateral/longitudal force exceeds 0.5 g. Source: 12 Cilindri Product Note, page 38. It is also mentioned that this high dowforce mode is activated in high performance handling and braking situations only. This means that flaps will never activate in straight line acceleration or cruising. They are intended to work momentarily only, and not to block rear mirror views in normal driving.
Ferrari hasn't disclosed overall downforce figures. We can only guess why. My guess is that they have priorised efficiency over max downforce and the figure without flaps would be smaller than in 812.
I have no idea how today Ferrari evaluates and scrutinizes the design of its cars presented by Flavio Manzoni, but in the past that's just an example how things happened. The Ferrari Enzo was revealed in 2002 and it does not use a rear wing but a small appendage that tilts slightly when it reaches speeds above 80 Km/h (a kind of predecessor to the 12 C adaptable rear flaps). Most of the necessary downforce is in fact generated by airflow beneath the car with the help of the rear extractors. The first version of the car, exactly as we know it today, had a large F40 style wing. Too much for Luca di Montezemolo who with his characteristic elegance, didn't want to offend Sergio Pininfarina who had presented it with passion and expertise by simply saying he didn't like it. And so he used a different tact, saying “Sergio, I’m sure you’re good enough to get the same downforce without using a spoiler”. And they succeeded perfectly so that the Enzo is an undisputed icon for its beauty and driving experience. What would have happened to the 12 Cilindri if Montezemolo was still the CEO of Ferrari today? We will never know and so we can only speculate but it is very likely that he would have said to Flavio Manzoni “Flavio, I’m sure you’re good enough to get the same down force without using those rear flaps” Image Unavailable, Please Login
I can already imagine a situation where a driver on the highway approaches a traffic jam, brakes hard and then doesn't see the traffic behind him because the flaps are extended.
It is hard to say without sitting in the car how much those flaps reduce the rear visibility. But for sure, they are not improving it. I think, during the braking, the focus is mostly in interior mirror so the flaps are not necessarily a big issue. It would be worse if flaps would activate also in acceleration. Then the rear corner visibility during lane changes could be compromised.
Sidebar: I'll say something contrarion, but I'm confident it's correct. The flaps should not be visible in your side mirrors. If they are (as they will be for nearly everyone), try adjusting your side mirrors out until you can no longer see your car. It's always puzzled me that we are taught to keep our cars visible in the side mirrors. Even if you can't see it, I promise it's still there! If you adjust the mirrors out, you'll find you no longer have blind spots. You'll just need to get accustomed to using the rear view mirror to see what's behind the car.
Valid point. While I prefer to have also a bit of car sideline visible in the mirrors, I agree that rear flaps are in locations that are not so important for rearwards visibility. Also, the massive rear fenders in 12 Cilindri are already hiding the rear view, so flaps don't rise much above fender line view anyway.
After seeing some of the concept drawings and real world photographs posted over the last week, I wonder if there was a disconnect between idea and implementation that Manzoni's team failed to acknowledge. It's rare for me to like concept drawings more than the end product; I typically find them too whimsical. But with the 12c, I prefer the sketches. The lines look organic in the drawings. But in the real world - with panel gaps, different materials, uneven shades of black, unpredictable lighting, less flattering angles, etc. - the graphics look forced and contrived to my eyes. I had an English teacher in high school who was fond of the phrase "kill your darlings". Perhaps that applies here.
I’m sure those flaps when up increase the size of the blind spot so lane changes may be a bit more challenging Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
I think you should see that area better from the interior mirror anyway. And as discussed before, that's not really the area of typical problematic blind spot, which is outwards from the side rear mirror view.
Yes, I don't really see how it will impact the view. Silly to think so. View out of the rear mirror won't be bothered, and wheel haunches will likely obstruct seeing the flaps. And it's not like they are raising very much.
Great point and I have done this for years but….it doesn’t work on the f8 coupe. I can barely see anything with my rear view mirror and have to use my side mirrors. My bday few months back and had the park police behind me in the presidio. Wide open roads and didn’t see anyone in front or behind so i cutting down the middle of the road to miss speed bumps. Little did I know but had an suv behind ,w the lights on. The first thing the cop says to me after following for over a minute was, didn’t u see me?! I said , no! I can’t see anything out the back. He actually laughed, saw it was bday and let me off. Wrong forum but warning to f8 owners.
Yeah well … actually no … Here is what I predict: This demasculazation of Ferrari design for its regular production car line up will start to erode the base of serious buyers for these cars and there will be a rebellion against the Jaguarification of Ferrari cars available for general purchase while the only actually interesting and compelling cars are limited to 499 customers globally.
Are the 12 C rear aero flaps a gimmick ? According to Ferrari the 12 C rear flaps rise only when speed is 60 – 300 Km/h and lateral G force exceeds 0.5 Apparently the active aero system steps up on tight turns or while braking hard and it will raise the flaps to increase grip and control. I imagine that cruising at high speed the flaps shouldn't be of great use because they should adjust to reduce drag. The Fiorano circuit, which has a lot of tight corners, will in theory be a place where this rear flaps system can prove its benefits. Interestingly, 5 months have passed since the car's presentation and Ferrari has not yet revealed the Fiorano lap time of the 12 C coupé. Are they having difficulty overcoming the lap time of the 812 Superfast? If the Fiorano lap time of 12 C coupé will be similar to the one of the 812 SF, we will then conclude that those flaps are just a gimmick.
You are putting some real pressure to Ferrari! Anyway, it is only 3 months since the presentation. But given that the car weights more, has less torque and has apparently a higher center of gravity due to taller tyres and body, I would not blame the flaps for possible failure to set a faster time. Ferrari claims the flaps interact with the diffuser (Source: 12 Cilindri Product Note, pages 39-40), so their effect might be a bit bigger than it looks visually. Then again, the flaps add downforce only by: 50 kg @ 250 km/h In lower speeds this translates to: 32 kg @ 200 km/h 18 kg @ 150 km/h 8 kg @ 100 km/h
Yes the flaps are a gimmick in my opinion. In a wild reversal of ‘form follows function’ these flaps are a contrivance meant to provide a plausible rationale for the styling department’s desire for a differentiated graphic design agenda at the rear of the car, that seems pretty obvious to me. We all know that without these flaps … the car would have performed just fine.
These are ridiculously low numbers, and it certainly wasn't worth adding extra weight, complex electronics and ruining the look. So just a gimmick.
It's true I got confused with the dates but for this purpose it doesn't make any difference If the 12 C coupé does not achieve a lower lap time in Fiorano than the 812 SF, then we are facing a clear inversion of what Ferrari has accustomed us to. In modern V12 GT Ferraris, the most recent model has always achieved a lower lap time in Fiorano than its predecessor.
@500tr, @inox, @MDEL https://www.topgear.com/car-news/big-reads/new-dodici-cilindri-last-chance-celebrate-ferraris-glorious-v12 The outer sections of the tail are the 12 Cilindri’s party piece: active aero on the top side of a front engined Ferrari for the first time. Both winglets rise simultaneously at 37mph, only by 10°, and only to add 50kg of downforce. Pass 186mph and the car gets the message you’re reaching for the top speed and lowers them again. Chances are then, if you see a 12 Cilindri on the road, those flaps will be on the up. Why didn’t Ferrari simply hinge the entire rear wing, like a McLaren airbrake? Simple: that would’ve compromised access to and space inside the 270-litre boot. And check out the SEVERE body roll in the Fiorano pictures, yeah, aero in a turn is going to make any difference at all, maybe to help dial-out the understeer(but, it will not accomplish that, it is just a prank, thanks Captain Dunsel...) With this car, Ferrari has no serious appeal to any 12 year old..
We can then conclude that these rear aero flaps are really a gimick as it seems that in practice they add little or nothing to the performance of the 12 C.
