LaFerrari replacement: v12, no hybrid, less power than SF90stradale?

There is a price cap in F1 so suggesting they lose millions (more) to win is nonsensical.


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I was talking about the 911, not about Porsche's halo car, if we can even talk about such a thing since they do not have the same tradition of Ferrari.
Hence why I said "Ferrari should have taken a somewhat similar approach to Porsche when it comes to its (Ferrari's) halo range"
Porsche has constantly improved the 911.

 

Ferrari's HALO car should be a track monster that beats everything out there and also delivers driving enjoyment and pleasure.
For that is needs to be as light as possible, 1200-1300 kg tops. That way the breaks and the car can be driven a lot on a track.
Also, it should only be sold to purists who track it.
Leave the rest of the range to clueless drivers who don't track them.

 

I was talking about how Ferrari should take a similar approach to its halo car the way Porsche does with the 918.

 

Nope, you are wrong. Some things are within the cost cap, some things aren't.

 

Some more great photos from Wilco Blok
https://www.instagram.com/wilcoblok/

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@Lcawley is absolutely correct. The unlimited cap is drivers, top 3 staff, and a stuff unrelated to the car dev.

Ferrari cannot

As someone who once claimed to be involved in F1—so, like, not just a casual fan but maybe more of a pit lane insider, right?—you should already know this stuff. Ferrari is already dropping big bucks on their drivers. So, unless you’re suggesting we go full ‘new team, who dis?’ mode, what are you implying? We're already chasing Adrian Newey with a Ferrari-sized check, and always on the lookout for the best talent.

And seriously, who’s on your dream list to replace Vasseur? Is it a ‘one season and you're out’ kind of deal for him? Maybe you think we can just lure Wolff, Horner, or Brown away from their posts? I guess Guenther would provide endless entertainment, just don't think it will bring the final prize, sorry.

You're not entirely off the mark, though. Something is definitely up in Maranello... but the problem isn't a lack of cash flow. Trust me, their wallets are wide open, ironically, that could be the problem.

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The Board is where the issues come from they are the one in control. $$$ are not an Issue Ferrari has more money than ever. The Board want more Cream and that comes at a trade off. Id also say the other Problem over all at Maranello is a Fruit one

 

Well said my friend.

 

The lap record around Silverstone is 1.24.3 by Lewis Hamilton in the W11. It weighed 746kg, the heaviest up to that time, and the fastest. Weight does not directly equal speed nor driver enjoyment. I recall Lewis enjoyed driving that car, certainly more than some of those lighter McLarens that he struggled with after his first championship.

No doubt low weight helps. But for speed, adding weight that comparatively helps speed is faster. As for driving enjoyment, again it is not always a truth that lower weight equals more enjoyment. I prefer a 458 to an Elise. Similar era cars, very different weights, one far ahead in my opinion.

Mixing this comment with your rather strange Porsche comment (911? You do realise how different a concept that car is and how different is its market?) By that token, you would have liked the F50 to look like the F40 but a bit lighter. The Enzo? Yep, very reminiscent of the F40 but a bit lighter still. The LaFerrari? Still looks like an F40 but we’re now at 1,000kg. To most people, that is just much more boring.

And the oddest element to your post - they should reserve the car only for people who are able to drive to a certain standard on track, irrespective of their ability to pay, makes the least sense of all. They would ultimately go broke for starters. But their stock in trade is passion. Imagine what that does to their connection with the customer base. An arrogant, elitist, financially stupid approach.

Nothing wrong with a company taking that approach, Lotus did something similar with the Elise/Exige. But it is for a very set customer, with a certain buying profile. It has nothing to do with F250 or the line that has gone before it. Complain all you like but that is the strategy they have been following since the 1980’s. And only now you criticise? Or if you criticised before and Ferrari have produced brilliant and fabled hyper cars despite your comments. Why would they listen?

 

You are also wrong.

Exceptions are made, for an example, when Aston Martin spent approx. $250 million on new facilities while the cost caps have been in place.

 

sorry but that makes no sense. The vast majority of buyers for Ferrari’s halo cars don’t track their cars. Have you seen any company sell a halo car for 2-3m that is not road legal in 500-600 copies? There is a reason for that. If you mean that Ferrari should make 50-60 of their halo car and try to sell it for 20 million then I can tell you it is just bad business

Ferrari’s halo car will always be a road car first and foremost. I do not disagree that it should be closer in spirit to the Valkyrie (high emotion, perhaps lower practicality, bespoke engine with high revs etc) and I would personally love to see a car in the spirit of the T50, but making a track monster and selling it to purists just wont happen

PS. The most successful halo car Ferrari made in terms of Current Value / MSRP is the 288GTO. Hardly a track monster and it shows you what Ferrari collectors value


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Photo by: Autopareri
HD: 1. https://www.autopareri.com/uploads/monthly_2024_08/IMG_9829.jpeg.a85cc107b43d4e4ddd84ffb258c5d879.jpeg
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Thank you I have created some bigger ones of your #2
-You can see a small wing on engine cover could be a camera but there is a Camera by Wing see 3rd image.
-With door open you can see the size of the air inlet if you look at the guy in red shirts hand you will see it
- 3rd image you can also the vertical tape on the Yellow and Red mutes area on the engine covers in fact is a vent in this 3rd image (green arrow)

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Orange Arrow: A curve on the side plate can now clearly be seen. Could be wrap but due to placement and look maybe real

Green Arrows: Far more detail and it curves in much more than pasts mutes
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Hi Jag !

 

interesting to see if the wing can go any lower.
even on photo I saw it was in this position.

 

You are comparing the factory claimed dry weight for the GMA, vs an actually weighed, fully fuelled LaFerrari (1585 kg the one I saw).

Regarding F1, Ferrari's problem is not the facilities, which are top notch anyway. Red Bull's wing tunnel, as a counterexample, is one of the oldest in F1. There seems to be something wrong with Ferrari's evolutionary path every year, as revealed again by their latest update which re-introduced porpoising. Then again, they are usually in the top 3 teams, which is not too shabby, regarding where other powerhouses (McLaren, Williams) have lately been. Ultimately though, Ferrari should compete for wins and championships.


@therryzsx: Ad hominem attacks indicate a lack of rational arguments.

 

This car is starting to look very exciting! I am sure it will be stunning. But how will it compare to the likes of the GMA T50, Valkyrie etc - and the best McLaren P1? These generations only come around once a decade or so, and we don’t get to live through many in our lifetimes. Such a landmark moment! Forza Ferrari - make us proud!

 

Even camouflaged this car looks stunning to my eyes for sure !

 

Ferrari have very long history of lying considerably about road car weights ( they are not alone), but to me it's all just dishonesty and should be illegal for a manufacturer to mislead buyers! It's no different than lying about power figures, its just that most people don't have a clue ( or seem to care) how much weight effects car performance in every single dynamic way! Gordon Murray is obsessed with car weight, and i'm going to bet his T50's are very close to what GMA claim, but lets wait and see, im sure Harry Metcalfe will have one soon to test and he weighs most cars he gets in.


You saw a Laf on the scales and it was 1585kg with a full tank of fuel? Please post the pictures or video. Or let me guess, you or nobody else around that day had phone on them! I have never seen a video or pictures of a Laf on scales, has anyone on here?

 

Appears to be 1650kg with lifter and hifi options.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/la-ferrari-actual-weight.481092/page-2

 

It's very interesting how compact a GMA is. The T50 is 4.35m long, and the T33 is 4.39m long, and contains a V12. Almost the same as an F355, which is 4.25m long.
A SF90 is 4.70m long, the length of a new Mercedes GLC SUV.
The difference in approach and mentality is impressive.
Those who advocate in favor of the current management often use the term "evolution".
Can a constant increase in weights and measurements be considered evolution?
Look, the heavier an object, the more energy it takes to move it, right? I'm not even talking about dynamics, but more basic physics.
A heavier car will overload the suspension, brakes, will need more energy to develop such performance than a lighter car, and all the extra weight of electronics.
I'm not saying that an SF90 or 296 would need to weight 1000 kg, like a GMA. I know that would have a very high cost.
But with all the know-how that Ferrari has, its rear-engine cars could weigh in the range of 1,350 kg to 1,500 kg, a weight suitable for a modern sports car, complying with all regulations.
The GMA has a 4.0 Cosworth V12. What's stopping Ferrari from developing a V12 of these dimensions (or even a little larger), lighter, and without the need for turbocharging, and building cars that are slightly lighter and more compact?
The answer is: maximize profits at all costs.
It is much cheaper and more profitable to add cheap power (turbos) plus electricity, resulting in a lot of power for a lot of weight and complexity, than build something lighter, less complex, and with the same performance potential.
The next chapter of this economy will be the F40 Icona: They will simply build a body in the F40 style, add the F154, the same digital dash, all without needing investment and effort, and they will have the narrative that the F40 was already twin-turbo, so this will legitimize the F154 in an Icona. And they will ask 2-3m euros for it.
Before any SF90 owner speaks out, I do not want to underestimate your car. If you own an SF90 and really like it, that's great. I know the car's potential very well, I do think that it has good things in the package, the construction, the finish, and it really is fast like no other car, but I do not agree with the attributes that are being sacrificed to sell these products, I do not agree with the direction taken and the mentality, and I know that there are many who share this same opinion.

 

Sad thing is, their is/was people at Ferrari that know all these huge negatives that come with heavy weight and large sizes, and pushed to change the design philosophy trajectory . They even proposed the Ferrari Mille Chili concept to the world, and stated they aimed to make it 1000kg or less (2200lbs). They choose in the end to take the profiteering route.