296 Values and Used Market

Cant say i'm a huge hybrid or electric car fan, but I can remember my dad saying "those disc brakes and power windows are unnecessary they are just something that's going to break"

 

Good thing with Hybrids, those brakes usually last longer (if you're not hard on them). Bad thing is those batteries *will* need replacing. And for Ferrari, it won't be cheap (likely because of how to get to it, because I know McLaren talked about how they made it so that it'll only cost about $6-9K to replace the Artura's).

And weirdly, it's been the manual windows that break more often than power windows (talking anecdotally here) and there isn't even a weight penalty with auto windows.

 

Corrected for effects of currency inflation the Enzo is not 8x its list price..closer to 3x or 4x (in constant dollars/pounds), just the same, with more inflation 4m will eventually become 12m, unless there is a huge currency reset

and it is pure speculation what price Ferrari will set for the new car, I think just under 3m is more likely

 

Then I presume your dad never drove spiritedly on mountain roads or on track, drum brakes are not up to the task of repeated braking, disc brakes are...

 

"It’s the economy stupid" Bill Clinton.

 

I suppose it's a fair point in purely realistic terms

I wonder which of the Ferrari hypercars is trading the highest x of his inital price adjusting for inflation

 

Not to derail the thead but probably 288 GTO, $75k new and if you just put it away and never drove it, a delivery mile car today is probably worth $6m, so that’s 80x

 

UK analysis of Ferrari is irrelevant to the US and other markets. I have no idea why they still sell cars there.

 

why wouldn't they? we buy cars and are making Ferrari profits

 

I looked into the docs they sent me. In Feb I negotiated a ~12.5% discount. With the price increase and my paint price doubling, I’m getting a pre vat price discount of £46k compared to someone ordering the same specs paying full price right now. Taking delivery this weekend.

They kept the same agreed price after trying to pull an £25k increase, which I told them to refund my deposit if they wanted that.

Still, would have another £50k saved if I went with a 2023 car with 1k miles (but I wanted a very specific spec and none are available).

I would have thought Ferrari will allocate more to US instead of UK. Or my dealer just ate the small or zero margins.

 

Ferrari is a major worldwide brand. Seeing the most recent models selling for a fraction of MSRP and a moribund secondary market is not good for the brand. I can't imagine Ferrari corporate is thrilled with four respected car enthusiasts discussing the problem with resale being due to the 296 design and structure either. Profits can be had elsewhere, brand dilution is a bigger problem. I would bet the allocations to the UK will be drastically reduced in the coming years.

 

If other countries follow the same trend, Ferrari will not be able to reduce allocations everywhere and increase production at the same time.
Although not as bad (yet?) as the UK, continental Europe also seems to have the market softening.

 

What Chris and the gang were saying re: Ferrari and 296s specifically apply not just to the UK, but more broadly. And it's certainly true here in the U.S., if not more so.

 

Not sell Ferraris in the second biggest economy in Europe? What a bizarre comment.

 

UK market appears to be oversupplied based on pricing/supply in second hand market there (compared to USA for sure, but even compared to EU). If I had to guess I would say it has something to do with the mix of truly local buyers, expats, and very wealthy “visitors” that makes it (particularly new cars) a more cyclical market than other geographies. And since UK is RHD, the cars get trapped there.

 

UK is oversupplied because

‘ its the economy stupid ! ‘

Too many people order these and other luxuries based on monthly payment , not the fact they can truly afford them.

 

Agreed, if you can't afford to buy the car in cash, you can't afford the car.

 

and.....rates are falling. We pay cash, but I have been told many times that we are in a very small minority who do. Most finance.

 

You don’t need to pay cash. You need to be able to pay cash. There’s a difference.

 

That’s not true at all, if you can’t afford to pay cash for your house does that mean you can’t afford it? Absolutely not. If you don’t have large cash reserves but have a steady income and can afford a payment then you can afford it.

Even if you can pay cash, you could have that cash in T bills at 5%, so there is a cost either way.

 

Homes generally appreciate though. Apples and oranges.

 

At the current market rate of return of 12%, for some people it’s better to keep 500k in the market and take a loan (or equity line of credit) at 6% and finance the car. They would rather have their cash working for them. There is a strategic reason that Ferrari Financial has so many customers. I’m sure most of those customers can afford to pay cash, but choose not to.

 

Agree. OPM principle esp when you can get higher returns on your own cash.

 

Agreed which is why I’d rather use my LOC than touch positions but I still believe if you’re going to buy a $500k car and make a payment you should have $500k in investments you should have min $5mm in investments.

 

That’s sensible but I think it comes down to how many cars you own at any one time - many people just have one sports car as oppose to a fleet of depreciating toys