1965 Le Mans Winner 250 LM 5893 coming to auction.

Rupert Murdoch?

 

That’s my point. It’s a lot easier to see art being very valuable in the long run. It is more important to humanity than sports cars. And very rich people need ways to spend their money. By the way I think the values seen today are a dip in a valley full of peaks and troughs. We will soon see stupid(er) numbers for cars once again - even if so called young collectors don’t like them. Which I disagree with but maybe at 35 I’m already too old.

 

Mario, I wish I were your age, with what I know now

Much older, but slightly wiser , although I plan to be around a looooong time.

Regards, Alberto

 

No need to be sorry my dear friend Alberto.

I did not say, I did not intimate, and I do not think that all art pieces purchased with hundreds of millions dollars prices is money laundering and tax evasion.
I did not make that categorically sweeping statement and I did not describe things in absolutes.
Also please note that my comment was specifically in response to your comment about paintings.
While my comments extend to the art world as a whole, I did not address car prices nor am I addressing them in this response.
I am speaking only of Fine Art and I do not include the art that Jay Leno refers to in his descriptor 'kinetic sculpture' (cars).
I am only speaking of the art world.

I did not categorically state that all art collectors live in the box of money laundering and tax evasion.

What I am saying and what I do believe is that the art world has long been a haven for money launderers and tax cheats.
And it has.

A great many (notice I am not saying all, nor am I saying 'the vast majority' or 'the pluratlity', or any other conditional... I simply don't have the percentages nor do I know anyone who does)
... a great many of the very high dollar art sales from the 1980s onwards are completely above board, beyond reproach, and totally legal.

That said, you simply cannot separate the unprecedented growth in wealth at the highest levels in the last 40+ years from the (continued?) corruption of the global art market as a safe haven for tax cheats and money launderers.
As the spike in HNV indiduals and their wealth increase has occurred, many unscrupulous persons have taken advantage of the opaque nature of the art world. These particular trading activities have influenced to some degree the dizzying increase in prices.

My bottom line, Alberto, is this: art prices would not be where they are today if you were able to separate out the transactions involving tax evasion and/or money laundering.

Anyhow, thank you for your comments as always and I hope things are well with you and yours.

 

Apples and oranges.

 

I actually think this was a strong result.
The Mercedes selling in the last week for 51.1MM was thought by some to be a soft price/weak market indicator.
The nearest analog to the 250LM is really the 250P rather than the 250 GTO.
The 2018 sale of the only double-LM winner, 0816 at a reported ask of 40MM should represent the high water mark.
In this context, the 5893 result looks healthy to me.

With respect to 250 GTOs, we have the public sale of 3413 and 3765 for basically 50.
The purported price of 70 for 4153- a high water mark- comes from the mouth of the buyer. I am unaware of any independent confirmation of this number. As strange as it may seem, it's possible a buyer could have a reason to state a higher sale amount than actual. I don't know the story in this case.
All 3 of these cars are at the top end of examples of the 36+1 cars.
Others that have lingered in recent times- market forces notwithstanding- can be seen as 2nd tier or lesser desirable examples of the original 36.
Just my opinion, FWIW.

 

Its also a very socially appropriate form of charity to invest heavily in art to display in a museum or art gallery. Not one museum around the world is going to turn away a permanent display of a Monet or van Gogh or any other proper masterpiece and the donor will always be lauded for their donation. A car, even a 250GTO or a collection of any scale, just doesn't have the social gravitas. I still don't see any of this as a monetized thing but there are few methods of going from nobody to a member of all the right circles in any international city quite like donating important art or artifacts.......

 

I've heard #5893 has a European buyer and he will "likely leave the car as is"

 

yes Rupert Murdoch

 

The 34.88 million EUR winning bid will also incur 5.5% VAT for this particular buyer won't it, making the purchase price 36,798,400 EUR ($38,343,932.8)?

 

So technically a painting of a GTO could be worth more than an actual GTO...?

 

Even though you are joking, a painting of a Mercedes Gullwing by Andy Warhol is definitely worth more than a Gullwing itself. Funny.

 

1/1 vs. 1/1400

 

Apologies if this has already been posted.


1964 Ferrari 250 LM by Scaglietti
The overall winner of the 1965 24 Hours of Le Mans, piloted by noted racing drivers Masten Gregory and Jochen Rindt on behalf of the North American Racing Team (NART)—was sold at The Louvre art gallery in Paris (home of da Vinci's 'Mona Lisa') for €34.8 million. The car was bein sold by the Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum as part of its rationalisation programme which will see it concentrate on Indianapolis racers.
This car is the only privateer-entered Ferrari to ever win the 24 Hours of Le Mans overall and the only Ferrari built during the Enzo Ferrari era (1947 to 1988) to compete in six 24-hour races, including three times at Le Mans and three times at the 24 Hours of Daytona.
The car has resided for 54 years in the Indianapolis Motor Speedway (IMS) Museum following its purchase from Chinetti Motors a few months after completing the 24 Hours of Daytona in February 1970.



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My money's on Reinhold Messner.
A much more interesting RM than the above mentioned.

 

Thank you for the kind note dear Dave! I really did not mean the "sorry", as you only say that when you run over someone's dog,
or worse a nun. Everybody says "sorry", but they don't mean it. I prefer 'xcuse me'.

The art world is very, extremely complex, and the values even more. When the world was a 'simpler' affair, money was not spoken of,
in the stratosphere of wealth. Now it is flaunted, narcos & Co. buy anything and everything, because they can and will. Launderers, same.
In Spanish, straight from the Bible, we say : "pagan justos por pecadores", " the just, pay for the sinners". That 2% that spoiled it all for the rest.

Imagine when we visited Picasso we just showed up, only a telegram appointment, he was playing petanque, excused himself from the other players,
" be right back", and after an hour or so, he went back. He received Francs (cash) we got a painting, end of story. Left with a canvas, no receipt.
Imagine that today...
In the day, they would smuggle Swiss watches into Italy, and cigarettes were the bread makers in Naples.

On another note, my grandmother gifted me a ( Ming, Ding, Fing, whatever dynasty) 12" tall incredible statuette she bought in Italy
eons ago ('50s or so), Ivory (clearly a no-no now) not when she bought it...Museum quality, a true work of art. I sent photos to ALL the auction houses,
and no one would appraise it for me, as...ZERO provenance, and I have friends there.....
Untouchable, undocumented, unsaleable, un-insurable, unless....you guessed it. So it stays.

Speaking to the curator of (THE) museum (to me), in Rome, a smallish one, but to die for, about this very subject, it took the better part
of one hour to clarify this topic, and too long to transcribe, she had +/- the same thoughts you express, and that I highly respect.

The world has become what it is. Went to the bank yesterday (USA) and deposited some cash, as having sold an engine head (heavens!)
They know me quite well, as a very ancient client. No, I had to deposit into my account, then turn into 100's to withdraw.
No way, 20's into 100's. And a receipt, 'cause if the cops stop me and question source, they can legally take it away. This, not to mention, travel.

This is the world we live in. Regrets, not Sorry

Wishing you likewise the best for you and your loved ones

Kind regards, Alberto

 

Not Rob Myers, not Rupert Murdoch, not Reinhold Messner and not Richard Mille.
5893 will soon live in a small town in the Franches-Montagnes in the French speaking part of Switzerland.

Marcel Massini

 

I think the most valuable ferraris are located in your country marcel, even it is one of the smallest countries

 

I was unaware that Raul Malo had decamped to Franches-Montagnes.

 

Franches-Montagnes is a district of a certain canton in Switzerland and the initials of the new owner are not R.M.

Marcel Massini

 

Correct. $50 million is insane money as is $30m+. Even $1m+ on a car is a lot. I'd love to have a collection of vintage Ferraris and I'm still in my 30s, but I don't have that kind of money. I have to work for mine, but if I inherited money or had a large windfall sure I would buy them but unfortunately not. Thanks to our debt-based fiat currency in the US and ever expanding US debt that means asset "values" will go up via accounting principles (assets = liabilities).

 

Ronald McDonald got bored with chasing the hamburgler and moved to Switzerland and bought a Ferrari?

 

Stieger family (3589 GT) live there…isn’t it?

 

Stieger family lives 300 kilometers away and has sold nearly everything

 

No.

Marcel Massini