Ferrari F80

Nevera is not Bugatti but we will see within couple of days now.
I can not wait to go to Hq and meet people behind this new hypercar

So F80 spec session has begun? Is the price out? And did customer pay the deposit?

 

The Power to weight ratio of a car is normally summarized as follows. The higher the ratio, the more power the car has compared to its weight, which means faster speeds and quicker acceleration.

In the table below in fact it can be seen that there is a direct relationship between the Power/dry weight ratio of each model and its acceleration. Fiorano’s lap times also have a direct relationship with the Power/dry weight ratio.
In the group of road legal Ferraris the F80 clearly stands out from all the other models due to its P./d.w.r. which is 20% higher than the one of the SF 90XX although, in terms of Fiorano’s lap time, the former is only 12% faster than the later. However, when we compare the F80, which is currently the road legal Ferrari with the highest power, 1184 hp, with the 499P Modificata, which is a racing car with a much less powerful engine with 858 hp, we find that the P/d.w.r. of the later it is 7% higher than the one of the former. Although there is no official Fiorano’s lap time, according to some testimonies left here by someone who followed the 499P Modificata while testing in Fiorano, the difference in time to the F80’s 1:15.30 is at least 5 seconds less.
The F1 SF 24 P/d.w.r. is the highest, 36% higher than that of the 499P Modificata, and this helps in understanding why its Fiorano’s lap time is less than 1 minute.

From the values presented in the table, it could be concluded that Ferraris with a better weight-to-power ratio accelerates faster and are also faster around Fiorano. Acceleration is detrimental in ¼ mile, ½ mile races and obviously very important around a race track. However acceleration is just one factor and is the combination of other factors like traction, drive type, transmission, engine characteristics, weight distribution, aerodynamics, sound quality and road type which really influence how good the driving experience will be.










Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Even if that is true, slick tyres alone would account for a large percentage of that delta. The rest would be the pure race car design.

 

Correct. It's not so much power-to-weight. Even a "lowly" 296 GT3 will run circles around a Koenigsegg One:1 or Jesko Attack on a racetrack. As for the 499P Modificata, it is mighty fast on the track because it's a legitimate race car engineered to do just that.

Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Thank you Mario, more great work to help move our discussion along.

It strikes me the posters above are on to something regarding tires and downforce. I have a feeling the downforce would play an even bigger role at a longer track with longer sustained high speeds. 499P Modificata, for me, is even beyond a supercar in terms of desirability. It has joined the 333 SP as an ultimate dream car for me. I think we will really have a much better understanding of the F80 when we learn driving impressions. For now I assume it will be incredible, Ferrari has a high bar to clear, but so far they have delivered in this regard.

 

never mind the 499p - the 360 gt2 car is faster around fiorano than the new F80 with 600hp+ less and that's a 25 year old car

 

I would still have a 499P on my poster, but, saying Id have a poster probably gives away some of my age!

 

It’s only physics. Regardless of age, knowing how to get 1,100kg race car on top of fat, slick tyres with a huge dollop of aero to stick to the road on a short, technical track has been known about for a long time. A 1,600kg car, with a hybrid 1,200hp powertrain, also lots of aero but, crucially, road tyres. Getting that to do the same?That’s the hard part.

Around a track like Monza or Le Mans, with their long straights, might be a different story. But even still, those slicks count for an awful lot of time. 360 was our first Ferrari. I never thought it was as pretty as the F355, but these days it looks very pretty indeed.

 

Even though we don't know that for sure (only hearsay so far), imagine how quick an F80 built for racing would be...

 

Cue the XX. That could be a very interesting (not to mention expensive) car!

 

Not to mention that the XX cars are not even proper race cars. Our mate willcrook, keeps mentioning the 360 GT2. Now, imagine Ferrari building a proper F80 race car...

 

I reckon they already did!
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Now imagine this with the trick suspension, active aero and 1200 HP.

 

The 499P is capable of driving outside the circuits, as has already happened on the streets and roads of Maranello. However, even if by some act of magic Ferrari made it road legal, that wouldn't make the 499P a minimally usable car for the road. Over time, not all Hypercars remained confined to the circuits. There were builders like Glickenhaus and Vanwall who offered road versions. The former with the SCG 007 LMH available in a road version with the name SCG007LMH/S. The latter with its Vanderwell 680 developed into a road version under the moniker Vanwall Vandervell 1000. However, these so-called road legal versions are basically of little or no use on the road.

The Valkyrie example is perhaps the most representative of what is in essence a race hypercar that they have achieved somehow that is road legal. We are talking about a small car, shorter and much lower than a 296 GTB, with a Power/weight ratio of 0.90 hp/kg which is around 20% higher than the 499P Modificata. The Valkyrie can also be used on the road and, as seen in some tests, is able to provide a great driving experience. However, the noise inside the cabin seems to be so unbearable that it requires occupants to constantly use earphones, as if they were in a helicopter. In short, it is a car whose natural habitat are the circuits but which from time to time can also drive on the road and thus impress passers-by with its gorgeous lines and the fantastic roar of its na V12.

It seems to me that the F80 is something very different from a Valkyrie. It is first and foremost a car to enjoy on the road but which will also be capable of providing a great adrenaline rush when pushed to the limits on a circuit.

 

Very nice you wrote comparison F80 vs Valkyrie. Totaly agree and at the end is F80 still road car and car which can normaly be driven on road, but on track also do very good lap times. Me also expect that F80 on track will very near to lap times of Valkyrie, but Valkyrie is totally unusable as road car. By me is now F80 probably best road hypercar for road using and go very fast times on the track.

 

The Valkyrie is a racing machine that weighs 255 kg less than the F80 and has a combined power (combustion engine + electric motors) of 1140 hp, a mere 44 hp less than the F80.
It seems to me that the lap times of these two cars can only be close on circuits whose layout is mostly made up of straights. For example in Fiorano who has 13 curves, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the Valkyrie's lap time was in the range of 4 to 5 seconds less than the F80's.

 

A track battle between the Valkyrie and the F80 will be very interesting.

 

It would be much less. F80 is 170hp more, 400kg more downforce and 100+kg less than XX Stradale yet only about 2s or so quicker. With law of diminishing returns, Valkyrie would be less than that faster than the F80 assuming the same tyre. Maybe in the 1.x second range but probably not even that.

 

Only if the car fires up at the track.
I heard so many bad things about it reliability wise.

 

Bench racing at it's finest.

 

Well, bench racing doesn't have to be entirely useless if one uses first-hand real-life data and rational extrapolation.

Based on a currently active professional race car driver driving the Valkyrie AMR Pro and a current LMP2 car, the AMR Pro was still slower than the LMP2. This was same driver, same track, same day.

An LMH (e.g. the 499P) is quicker than an LMP2.

So, in real life: 499P > LMP2 > Valkyrie AMR Pro >>> Valkyrie road car

If you go by the F80's purported Fiorano lap time, it's ~ 7-7.5 seconds slower than a 499P Modificata around Fiorano. (I shared a 499P Fiorano telemetry screenshot earlier.)

A Valkyrie road car is meaningfully slower than a Valkyrie AMR Pro on slicks.

Therefore, even though one can't use bench racing to pinpoint the delta between the F80 and the Valkyrie road car, it is not possible for the Valkyrie to be "many seconds" quicker than the F80. I agree with what @Lukeylikey said. I wouldn't even bet on the Valkyrie being quicker.

 

Valkyrie have arround 1400 kg weight, is not light as many people think. One enginer which worked on Valkyrie project nice described power of Valkyrie, electric power help only in low rpms and other things which are not directly related to performance, but never in same moment engine produce max 1140 hp power (1000 hp from ice and 140 hp ev). So in same time produce Valykrie max 1000 hp. Tyres are Porsche N0 specificic....also on track like Silverstone I expect at the end F80 will very near to lap time of Valkyrie.

 

1270 dry.

The motor is also utilised at high speeds.

 

About weight, one picture is sticker with weight of real car https://cdn.rmsothebys.com/6/3/5/4/7/e/63547e162b38ecd7637cb756a4e55c6028c0715b.webp and on page 110 Valkyrie brochure are other weights https://www.autoevolution.com/pdf/news_attachements/the-aston-martin-valkyrie-costs-two-lamborghini-supercars-to-service-over-three-years-218245.pdf ....1270 kg I not found. I bet that in press will 1270 but in oficial documents its not.

About power, information which I wrote was said by engineer who worked on Valkyrie. Told that in same time car never produce more like 1000 hp.

 

Short video of F80 in hills arround Maranello

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Qe1TzynR-zA