The BORA

Facet pumps seem to require more amperage than the Bendix pumps. If the Facet pump is not working properly the fix is to install a relay and add a fused line from either the battery or the starter. Use this line for the load (pump) and the existing wire to trigger the relay.

Ivan

 

No, this is not our Bora. The owner posted his experience on a Bora FB page. This was not long after he purchased this Bora, a very original car. I'll see if I can recapture the whole story...

These XWXs were very old, and it occurred at highway speed.

I saved this photo from his post, specifically because it shows how dangerously XWXs fail: Suddenly, totally, and catastrophically. They shed their entire tread all at once, as you can see. Sidewalls probably help maintain directional control, while 15lbs of rubber is slung against your sheetmetal. This caused thousands in damage.
- Art

 

When my Indy was restored and new fuel pupms had to replace the failing Bendix units, I requested that a relay be put in line for each Facet.

 

Why not just run a heavier gauge wire?
After all you still need to do that anyway for the power source switched by the new relays.
Are there manual switches on the dash for tank selection that need to be protected?

 

Putting relays is smarter than putting heavier gauge.
Yes there is a switch between tanks on the dash.
I am not knowledgeable enough in electrics, I asked my specialist to improve and secure the system, couldn't say if they need to be (and were) protected,

 

Only if the switches won't support the heavier load and in that case you have to add new fuses between the heavier load and the new relay(s). This is often done for new, higher load cooling fans or for headlamps when the old circuit has a voltage drop that you would rather not replace so you utilize the old switches and relays to operate the new relays with a new higher load wire run directly to load and mount the new relay(s) locally.

It does add complexity and more relays to maintain. But sometimes you just have to do that.

 

Took the Bora to cars and coffee. First time showing it. Favorite comment “is that a Subaru?”

 

Get used to it, it's an oddball car. At least you made it there and back WO a major incident!

 

“Alhamdilullah”

 

Next question. When I roll my windows up if I hold the button a millisecond too long it blows the fuse.

motor going bad?

Or

stop whining about stuff that’s normal for an old Maserati?

 

It is not normal. If the window is working fine otherwise, consider adding a circuit breaker with an automatic reset to the motor. Many cars have a circuit breaker incorporated in their window motors. Instead of blowing fuses the circuit breaker will trigger and then reset in a short time after it cools down a bit. Get one with an amperage slightly less than the fuse.

Ivan

https://www.amazon.com/Meskliu-Automatic-Breakers-DC12V-24V-Automotive/dp/B0BF55SZ3D/ref=sr_1_3?crid=1G6GNJX4NXGKT&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Tj6kvFbA_TDLr6SXT_zIrx916d_LGGybOTFVQPGmU_lSqJWCQu4QffGF2Z3xlQ2JKn8a58lsi-oV3ZZzyyaIQ9kU7CbFt4hiId2T1wFHomtFqwmOvJAhJaANof4RX55kNifoPLJjTPhp5gIeKEoM_KZCP4mvDnDjDuovaFZZUj8azhbSQRawPextpSFc1Ppt85AjHz_-ZyMdRdjimwxyqnSw5Hue23FhWMSagkNVSPo.VEzGtBVVCtAyfE0UcLX8m9d-w1FmEdYqqv4j54F7--g&dib_tag=se&keywords=in%2Bline%2B10amp%2Bcircuit%2Bbreaker%2Bautomatic%2Breset&qid=1742777992&sprefix=in%2Bline%2B10amp%2Bcircuit%2Bbreaker%2Bautomatic%2Breset%2Caps%2C164&sr=8-3&th=1

 

It never happened to me.

 

@Cepat:
I have a similar hesitating/whining climbing up of my windows in my Indy.
Obviously the electrical motors were designed a bit weak, or the wiring gauge is not strong enough, or there are bad electrical contacts (the latter for sure, as sometimes it needs several attempts on the switch to have the window starting its movement).

@thecarnut :
Yvan, what is the correct amperage to choose for a windows circuit breaker: 5A or 10 A?

 

I think factory is a 15amp fuse. I plan to put a 15amp auto reset breaker like Ivan suggested above and I will change the fuse to 20amp and hopefully that will keep it from blowing inadvertently. I will probably check the wiring while I have the door panels off to install the breakers.

 

The Indy user manual specifies an 8 amps fuse, which seems too low. The Bora manual specifies 16 amps. For the Ghibli there is a fuse for the right window and another for the left. If this Bora is blowing 16 amp fuses I would use a 15 amp circuit breaker. Of course, it should not be blowing a fuse so there is something going on. The circuit breaker is a patch.

Ivan

 

Why would you install the breakers inside of the doors?

My Espada has VERY slow windows, it's a known problem on those cars which also has a Rube Goldberg of a window lift design with a complex wire spool setup. Some owners have also seen voltage drops at the motors on those and have run a new heavier wire (including the ground) from the motor inside the door to a relay based switching setup mounted under the dash that's operated by the original switch in the dash as a switching circuit only for operating the relays that supplying a direct wire of heavier gauge with voltage from a main feed with a new fuse. This way the new fuse or breaker if you prefer and relay are easily accessed WO removing the door panel. I think said reversing relay is mentioned somewhere on Fchat as a ready to install unit. Search is your friend.

But also check out the motor and tracks in the door.

 

Well I was thinking quickly adding the auto resent breakers in the form of ATO fuse size in a waterproof fuse holder would be a very quick fix to the fuse popping. However the windows do move very slowly and more current to the motors may be of benefit. So will investigate the relay option as well.

 

Measure the voltage drop and perhaps how many amps are actually being draw. It could be because of an incapable circuit wiring or ... there's a lot of mechanical binding in which case you don't just want to add more power as things could heat up and result in a fire. It's not that difficult as a test to temporarily direct wire the one window and see how many amperes are being drawn and measure the voltage drop.

 

Good idea. Also considering removing all the old grease from the mechanism and maybe from the gear at the motor and replacing with new. For the felt lined tracks I usually spray with dry silicone lube. will likely have to do most of this after the weekend show and rally.

 

MIE sells brass gear replacements for the nylon ones in the car.

You have time for that now?

 

Nope. But would like to do a window rehab in the future. The fuse popping issue is a new one.

 

Well you could try the dry silicone with a window open as a stop gap.

 

These are self resetting circuit breakers. No need to reach inside the door panel to reset them.

Ivan

 

Good point. I forgot about those nylon window gears. Get rid of them as soon as possible. MIE and most Pantera parts sources sell a brass gear that will last forever and will most likely fix the problem.

https://maseratinet.com/maserati/quattroporte-i/maserati-kyalami-window-regulator-gear-mie000109

Ivan

 

Here’s a 15amp ATO fuse style auto reset breaker wired into the contacts for the window fuse.

lubed the window cat whiskers with dry spray silicone lube. They go up and down plenty fast and the breaker doesn’t trip. It’ll get me through this weekend’s car show and rally - “inshaAllah”
Image Unavailable, Please Login