First 787 Dreamliner crash: Air India

There's now info from the sole survivor... talk about a miracle. He's been interviewed and talks about getting out of the plane

Jedi

https://www.cnn.com/2025/06/12/india/air-india-crash-survivor-vishwash-kumar-ramesh-intl-latam

 

He talks about the 787 flap settings at 6:55



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Miracle shmeracle. Guess the ~250 dead didn’t pray enough.
Wonder how high the price to choose seat 11A will be on future flights. They should have an auction.
If someone did retract flaps instead of the gear that doesn’t explain why it took so much of the runway to get off the ground.

 

Assuming they were at MZFW, and fuel for 4500nm, TOW would be approx 460kips. Temp has been around 80F, so Std+31. Runway is 11500ft long. Chart shows they need a bit of runway.
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I read somewhere they started their roll from the intersection they turn on at not the full runway which may have limited their choices to abort the take off

 

Flightradar24 confirmed that was not true. I will say if they find something wrong with the 787 that caused this crash you will see directives come out this weekend.

 

So this indicates they should have needed ~9000' of runway for takeoff, with full flaps? Ahmedabad airport at 190' ASL.
I'd probably prefer a few extra feet as well.
That had to royally suck for the pilots, feeling the plane struggling to gain altitude while the city got closer and closer...

 

Thanks for the video that was really good. I also still think dual engine failure and will speculate software issue. Fuel contamination is not the first time a plane has crashed, but off the top of my head that British Airways flight had ice form in tanks and crashed on landing from fuel starvation (BA 38 looking it up). It wouldn't be the cause in this case for ice as it was never at altitude, but I guess they could have had enough water that separated in the tanks to do this if not some other contaminant.

edit: That BA flight was the first 777 hull loss apparently so for the first 787 hull loss to have a similar causes would not be surprising.

 

Whatever the cause turns out to be, considering this was a well-used aircraft of a type that's been in service for over a decade, I can't see how Boeing is likely to be tagged with a design flaw.

 

It doesn't have to be a design flaw as it can be a manufacturing flaw. Didn't the Alaska Airlines 737 door plug blow off as the bolts weren't put on correctly and nothing to do with the design itself? Former Boeing QC manager John Barrett had issues with manufacturing of the 787 where metal shavings were left around wiring looms on the plane and could cause issues down the the line. The FAA required Boeing in 2017 to address that issue. I'm not saying metal shavings messing with wire affected it, but certainly assembly line employees not doing things exactly how Boeing say it should be installed can definitely be the issue here.

 

I have not seen any directives yet regarding this accident for the 787, but that does not mean we won't see one soon if they need to. Captain Steve put out another video in which he says the RAT was running, based on a new clearer video of the aircraft just before impact, and I think he is right.

 

new theory based on gear position (couldn't retract due to dual engine failure?), also discussion on flaps and fuel, from airline pilot
Air India 787 Crash, The Pilots did NOT Forget the Gear

 

Still nothing from investigators. There was talk the fuel cut off switches would cause both engines to loose power, and also deploy the RAT when both engines stopped.

Just to add a little conspiracy, at the very beginning there was a rumor of an FA in the flightdeck jump seat. Now they keep saying 2 flight crew flying, but do not say 2 flight crew in cockpit. CVR will tell.

 

No real new information. From what we know the aircraft had loss of thrust for some reason. Here is something someone posted in AN that could be what happened. The question is still why. I am leaning towards improper mtx, but could also be a design flaw that showed up after 14 years in service.

One Scenario is losing the battery, along with the Battery Buses.
If both Thrust Lever resolvers fail electrically the EEC will hold the last valid angle signal for 2 seconds, then set the engine thrust to idle.

 

The black boxes were sent to the US apparently and will probably take a while for them to release results.

The only thrust lever theory I've noticed a few times mentioned is the TCMA (Thrust Control Malfunction Accommodation). Apparently that system cuts fuel to the engines if it thinks it's on the ground and the engine is providing higher thrust than throttles indicate to prevent runaway. Someone else pointed out the landing gears/trucks were still tilted up/forward like when it's on the ground as during gear retraction they tilt flat (parallel to fuselage) and then go into the plane. They said maybe the plane thought it was still on the ground and noticed the engines were providing max thrust and the sensor info it gave said throttles were at idle so then rolled it back. There are redundancies in the system with both engines separated with different sensors and wiring as well, but then someone else said the throttles share the same wiring the first foot and then it splits and duplicates. Not sure what the case is, but I'm still leaning to software error and it will be easier to figure that out if that data is recorded vs something physical that is burned and no longer identifiable at the crash site.

An ANA flight back I think in 2019 had both engines shutdown during landing (after touchdown I think) due to some throttle positioning messing with the computer's calculations that it shutdown both engines. And after the plane came to a stop they weren't even able to restart the engines there and had to be towed away.

 

Watched pilot debrief on YouTube last night. He posits that they lost 1 engine at or shortly after rotation and the pilots may have inadvertently shut down the wrong engine. Wouldn't be the first time that has happened.

 

Includes interesting info about the 787's heavy dependence on electrical power and what might have gone wrong:

 

Saw this one today. Who knows if it is close to fact.


https://punchng.com/pilots-faulty-seat-caused-air-india-crash-report-reveals/

 

I suppose it is possible but if his seat slid back .......why did he grab the throttle levers? They would have been set for take off. Seems hard to believe but if it happened due to the seat.....back to pilot error and a seat maintenance issue.

 

Its a reaction to grab at something. There was time to just let go and allow the copilot to take action.

 

I did not understand that the pilots reclined position prevented the co pilot from taking action…..must be a translation problem.

 

I dont either unless the captain would not let go of the throttles. Its not like its tandem seating. Reading between the lines sounds like he panicked and was determined to get back in position and was using the levers to do so.

Cluster **** started when pulling chocks.

 

Fact-Check: Viral "Air India Crash Preliminary Report" a Hoax – Aviacionline