F1 2025 Hungarian(Budapest) GP Pre-Race Thread

I won't generalise, I met honest politicians. But there are certainly bad apples in the barrel.

 

Liberty can reduce ticket prices to start with. Make basic food and water affordable for a family to enjoy an F1 race. They wont as the promoter has no choice but to literally charge insulting prices for virtually nothing in terms of food and drink in a basic sense. Its not even funny anymore, its sanctioned robbery for watching 200 meters of a circuit lol.

Value for money is not found in F1 at all. The only thing that matters are the 'value' of the new, team/investment-fund franchise concept.

Unique is not found in F1 its oversold with so many DTS fan circuit/city experience - getaway races now!. Why be party to that with a government tax on people who do not attend, as most dont lol. Good luck with that mentality. There are a 'myriad' of 'entertainment' racing options that cost less and offer a good racing experience compared to F1. There is not a single F1 race I would attend if given a choice between Le Mans or F1.
Ferrari are winning there and there is distinct competition and in general a better racing atmosphere with a hint of a heritage that surpasses F1. What an amazing challenge that is compared to 45 laps of tyre management and processional races now at circuits that once offered a competitive challenge.

Watch F1 on tele. its much better and the net cost is about what its worth.

 

My view entirely. F1 is very poor value for money nowadays and has become very elitist.
When I hear how much people pay a ticket to attend GPs, I can see it's certainly not affordable for ordinary people to take their family there like it used to be.
Every year, I used to travel to several GPs in Europe in the 70s, 80s and 90s, and it was quite affordable.
Now F1 is a cash cow for Liberty; they have turned it into show business; the sport content is not very interesting, and certainly not worth what people pay for. It's mostly razzamatazz of poor taste.
Why would I go to a GP when only a few hours of racing interest me? I can satisfy my interest by watching it on TV, it's far cheaper with better coverage, and without having the feeling of being mugged by Liberty.
I suspect many people think like me, and good luck to F1 to keep its new audience.

 

Now this. F1 should recommend teams give out free tickets etc given the current Investment Fund/Club valuations such as this today =
Aston Martin F1 team hits $3.2billion valuation in latest stake sale

 

I'm always doubtful about this kind of calculations - finding people ready to pay 146M for 22% of the shares does not mean there are people ready to pay 3.2Bn for 100%

 

When the real number show a 50% stock price fall and failing sales even for the Super-Cars they build its a cash infusion to literally a broke Lux-Car maker. Aston as a car company is floundering literally lol.

But Go Lance, Go Stroll Sr lol! Fool the world awash in wealth. Chinese or Saudi money??

--Aston Martin Lagonda has been in rough waters for some time. The maker of drool-worthy models like the Vantage, DB12, and DBX has seen its stock plummet by 50% over the past year. Second-quarter revenue tanked 34%, hit hard by sluggish demand for supercars like the Valkyrie and the upcoming Valhalla.--

 

I feel that the Valkyrie and the Valhalla have no Aston Martin DNA.
I have no idea if they will attract many buyers.

Aston Martin troubles started when its CEO Andy Palmer (ex-Nissan) needed capital to finance its rear engine projects.
He wanted to transform it from a Limited Company to a Public Company listed on the Stock Exchange to attract funds.
Most investors found that at £5Billion, the company was grossly overvalued.
The share price plummeted immediatly, Palmer was sacked and Aston was in trouble.
Lawrence Stroll and his Yew Tree investors bought the ailing company at rock-bottom price.
Their mistake, IMO, was to take over Palmer's pet projects. Those are a bottomless pit and not in the Aston tradition.

 

Let's see the bright side of life: is this the end for Lance Stroll?

 

I sure hope not. Go Lance!

 

Yes I did follow all that. Aston is a market follower not leader. There is nothing in the offerings that are unique. Easily over looked.

 

The night before the last race weekend going into the summer break, and nothing being discussed here about the weather, the drivers, the cars, the track or anything else. Oh yes, some posts about the fractional sale of Aston Martin that will have zero impact on the next three days. And Hamilton announced his celibacy so he could focus on driving. I wonder if we'll see Sydney Sweeny in the grid walk? Will Christian Horner start wearing disguises and try sneaking into the paddock? Enzo sold road cars to pay for his racing...Elkann sells tee shirts and hats. Surely there must be more financially rewarding ways to invest money than in F1. I'm wondering when we start to see ticket sales drop, followed by ticket prices, followed by tv viewers, followed by owners who will wish they had sold to Andretti.

 

The weather is not a real issue. Sunday morning showers potentially. No real significant upgrades are coming for the rest of the year. It will be warm so tyre life might be an issue. Other than that - this is a processional race with tyre management lol. Go Oscar!

Oh yes -- the new updates to the track facilities will be the talk of the first 5 minutes today. Its a nicer place to watch a procession. No real change overall lol.

 

Now that we’ve wandered off topic anyway I’ll take the opportunity to reiterate my prediction that Newey will not be the savior of AM that many have predicted. I don’t think he has the motivation that he once did and I believe the skill set now required is perhaps beyond his range. I’m prepared to take the heat if I’m wrong. I’m used to it!

 

I am afraid only some kind of spectacular crash (lets hope not, for the sake of drivers) might interrupt the incoming boredom on sunday...

 

Lovely, thanks for chiming in.

 

You could be right. Who knows ?
Many people think, wrongly in my opinion, that a top designer can re-invent himself over and over again.
Engineering (which is what F1 is) is a science, in constant evolution. It demands to people working in that field to constantly update their knowledge to keep up with progress. It's the same in the medical field. It's very demanding for those who want to stay ahead to catch up with the latest technologies over decades. Even the brightest engineers reach a plateau where they cannot digest and apply the latest trend. They are in competition with a new generation that has been taught the latest novelyies and take them for granted.
In the industry, it's not unknown to "recycle" older engineers in planning, production, plant management, etc...
Newey hasn't adopted the latest design methods, that puts him at a disadvantage, I think, to communicate with new engineers. New systems have arrived during his already long career, more familiar to 30 years old fresh from uni than to him. So, I suspect his role will be more in the management of the design office, than getting in the "nitty gritty" of the design itself. I may be wrong.

 

I think you are confusing culture with sport.

France has such a budget problem ( amongst many others ) sponsoring F1 is not a solution. GOVT usually support F1 based on the idea of economic activity improvement... but France has the opposite issue - ( socially at least ) too much tourism. The French want less tourists ( even though its now the main economic driver for their economy ) French auto industry is not big enough to really say they need F1 to help promote them... The last time I was in France, I just found that it was very hostile to car users... just try to drive into Paris, or any larger city... there is no parking, the congestion zones are killer, and there are so many restricted areas now... its very un friendly to car lovers. Sadly since the days of Bugatti, Delage, Talbot Lago etc.. they have not made any great cars... the DS is cool, but not great. the last great French car I can think of that I would want is the 205/206 Peugeot, and the Renault Clio Williams .... but rather an Abarth 595....

 

Not half !!!
To force the buyers to switch to electrification, France has introduced a diabolical tax system for ICE car sales.
At the time of purchase, a tax based on the CO2 emission of the vehicle is applied, added to the sale price.
It starts from 50€ for 113g/km (grams of CO2 per kilometre) to reach ... 70 000€ for 193g/km +.
To give some examples, a VW Golf can be taxed from 240€ to 43 179€ depending on engine size.
For a BMW Serie 4, it varies between 1901€ to 20 569€, from 330€ to 1905€ for a Hyundai Tucson.
A Ford Mustang is penalised with a tax of 70 000€; it simply DOUBLES the showroom price !
Of course most ICE big or luxury car. and sportscars are in the maximum bracket,
Now I read the legislator wants to increase the maximum to 80 000€ for next year!!

The only way to escape that is to buy ... electric !

 

It is an interesting discussion for sure. My take is however the experience in interpreting the rules, and translating that into design is where Newey has the biggest advantage. coming out of Uni - you may know the latest software and how to use it, and even interpret the results, but you would not know how the rules are written and the "gray" areas that abound, or even where to look. Sadly this is where innovation is in F1... Frankly how to cheat, not get caught very soon or at least when you do make the argument that its legal. that is what Newey has done for years.

I do think that he will lift Aston Martin up - but it will depend on Stroll bankrolling the project. I do not expect huge results next year - unless they change drivers, but I do expect them to be consistent top 6 in Qualifying. I'm not sure wins will be on the table, but with rule changes ... it does toss the salad a bit more.

 

I did not think Spa was a procession... it was a pretty good race.

 

You are in a distinct minority lol. Even the midfield was somewhat quiet exept for LH moving forward into the points.

 

when it comes to F1 I'm definitely in a minority. I'm too old school purist what ever you want to call it. I do not expect lots of excitement or passing in an F1 race. To me that is not the point. I watch because its the best ( or should be the best ) drivers in the best cars. when I was a kid growing up nobody complained that Stewart, or Fittipaldi or Lauda were running away with the championship and that the races were dull.. we went to see the great drivers in great cars... that was the excitement.

in the 80's and 90's it was the same thing - but coupled with all the high technology... to this day, I can still vividly remember standing next to the guardrail at Monza and seeing, feeling a turbo Lotus, Ferrari and McLaren come flying by... the ground shook, the air moved, and the smell... ah... the smell! same in the early 90's with all the atmo engines... V12's V10, and V8's you could hear them for miles around... when I was a kid and going to Watkins Glen, you could hear the cars warm up in down town when the wind was right.... those were the days.

So I don't pretend to demand a "show" ... you are getting a show to see the cars and drivers do what they do in my opinion.

 

+1
There were far less wheel-to-wheel fights in the past, because it was more dangerous.
Drivers were sitting between 2 fuel tanks, and contact could become disastrous, hence more respect.

 

This is a nice way to look at it.

 

Agreed, and also the quality of the driving was much more precise, and therefore better. today you can just barge right into someone with no consequences... its WWF in cars. This may offend some, but F1 has been dumbed down too much.