Shifting into First, when?

i was always told that "riding the clutch" is not good, either... i couldn't explain the mechanics to you if my life depended on it, but that's what i've been told... Now, putting the car in neutral and releasing the clutch is a different story, that's cool...

Whenever approaching a stop sign (and driving a stick), i just put the car in neutral and release the clutch. After i've come to a complete stop at the stop sign (a lost art here on Long Island), i re-engage the clutch, shift into 1st and, well... the rest is history...

 

Depending upon technique, you brother is either right or wrong. It is easy to tell which: If the nose of the car bobs up or down, or you hear a crunch, or you hear a while of a synchro, then your brother is right.

However, if you blip the throttle to rev match the engine and driveline, and the gear drop in with a snick just like shifting the box up, and the nose neither bobs up or down, then absolutely no harm is going on.

Note: clutch should be disengaged (pedal in) only for 1-2 seconds at a time, any longer requirements give you time to put the transmission in neutral and release the clutch pedal.

I can hit 1st gear as fast as 40 MPH in my F355 under the senario in paragraph 3.

 

Maybe i'm conservative, but i can't see downshifting into first, which i regard as a launch gear. Rather use the brakes if i am slowing down that much, can't see that balance and attitude of the car will make that much difference at 40-50 miles an hour, which is the upper limit of first in most high performance cars, yes?

 

Yea If im driving a stick I hardly ever get into first unless Im at like a stop light where Im going to be fully stopped.

 

First for me tops at 42mph. That's quite high for what it is. And reverse, oddly enough, it's 50 (GPS verified!).

I downshift to first quite often, and it needs a good tossing here and there. I find it quite useful in the twisties. But not all cars can shift back into first. Some have a lockout or other mechanism disallowing this practice. So, it depends on the car and transmission.

 

my car does 61 mph in first gear, i'll drop to first if racing at any speed below 40-45. But its very easy to light up the tires in first so it takes finesse to maximize acceleration

 

What rob says is correct. Even though the clutch is in, the transmission is still spinning at road speed. The only difference is its disconnectd from the engine. In most cars you either cant put a car into first if you are going to fast- it will either bounce off the sycros or grind, or it wil be hard and require some effort. When i drive a stick car in a normal fasion i dont put it into first unless i come to a complete stop, or am turning onto a hill at a low speed and i need 1st to g oup the hill.

 

Interesting thread...how about a situation like this which I encounter pretty much every day. Say Im driving at 50mph and the light up ahead turns red. I put the car in neutral and brake slowly to a stop. However when Im at about 5mph at a really awkward point between first and second, what gear do I shift into? Will popping it into first, blipping the throttle and matching the revs, and releasing the clutch hurt the synchros? I do match revs before I actually engage in the gear. If I put it into second at that speed it requires a bit more easing off the clutch to get in gear without the car sputtering. I never shift into first while moving unless Im in a situation like that though...My first gear only goes up to around 30mph anyway but I usually shift at 3,000 (~15mph). Redline is below 5,500.

 

so far so good. However, to maximize your chance of coasting through the red period of the light, leave the car in gear and use engine braking. Revert to real brakes only if you actully have to stop or the engine braking is not slowing sufficiently. Also note: begin deceleration the instant you know the light will turn red--this is often before it actually turns red--this gives you more time and distance to perform the red light avoidance manouvers.

 

GUYS: THIS SHOULD BE THE HARD RULE:

I usually toss the car to nuetral from second gear when approaching a stop sign. The only exception is when Melodie is putting on lipstick. In that case, I will always downshift from second to first gear. At that point, she'll turn to me and all I see is a big line of red lipstick from her lips to her ear. I just laugh my a$$ off!...try it sometime!

 

i am king of the rolling stop, i stay in 3rd

 

As mentioned earlier, you are doing no damage to the transmission, clutch, or synchros if you are properly rev matching when downshifting at speed. If you are just sticking the transmission in gear with the clutch disendgandged, you are not doing much damage either (although it is better to wait till the transmission accepts the gear-it pops in). If you are just sticking it in gear and releasing the clutch letting the clutch and synchros take up the slack, you are hurting the car.

Some above mentioned double clutching, it is not needed on today's transmissions (although it is fun to do) because of the advanced synchromesh gears. Single clutch rev matching is fine for most applications but I definately reccommend you learn how to double clutch. There is very few feelings better then exectuting a perfect 5-4-3-2-1 heel and toe, double clutch downshift. Very fun!

 

LMAO...! Peter, remind me never to do ANYTHING in the passenger seat of your car while you're driving...

 

carbee...Are you telling me you wear makeup? Please explain.

 

When I'm Autocrossing in my S2000 at Miata Club events I MUST downshift to first at the two carousels they typically put into the ends of their courses. Their courses are really tight.

It's simple enough: just heel 'n toe downshift while braking like a banschee to invoke ABS and make it into the tight carousel turn with a bit of understeer, then squeeze the throttle to the floor starting at 5/8 of the way around the carousel and countersteer to control the oversteer.

This is about a half second faster than leaving it in second and dogging around the carousel. Two carousels are about a full second faster!

In my 308 GTB QV I would just dog around as it has some more low RPM torque, and the transmission is more expensive to fix...

Kind Regards. Chris