Have Ferrari gone soft?

And I find the F50 to be stunningly beautiful... the way they tied all the lines together in a coherent fashion makes it a huge step above the F40. The Enzo wasn't designed to be more beautiful than the F50... it was designed to be a monument to Mr. Ferrari, and as such, is designed to resemble an F1 car converted for street use... and in that, they succeeded admirably.

And so completes three wholly different rankings of Ferrari supercar beauty. And that is what makes Ferrari great... the produce very different designs that appeal to very different people.


As for the original question... spend some time looking at the designs from the 60's. Study the most beautiful Ferrari of all (IMO), the P3 / P4. Study the 246GT... another beauty. Study the F50. And then the 360 Modena. The similarity of lines and curves is unmistakable.

Study the 250GT's and 250GTO's, and then the Daytonas, and then the 550 Maranello. Again, the consistency of lines and curves is quite obvious.

Now, if you're looking for the 308, the 288GTO, the F40, and the Testarossa lines in a 360 or 550, you'll be severely disappointed.

But given these trends tend to go in 20-30 year cycles, it wouldn't surprise me if the next decade's Ferraris bring back some of the 3x8/TR lines combined with the Enzo lines.

 

i completely agree brian

 

Delivery truck looks notwithstanding, the 914 2.0 was one fun car!

As far as Ferrari design, too much attention is being paid to aerodynamics just to be able to claim a uselessly high max speed -- ultimately max speed is drag limited so Cd reduction is a big deal.

If the market wasn't so obsessed with max speed and horsepower, we'd be seeing a lot more interesting sports cars from Ferrari and the others. Not as fast maybe but smaller, lighter, quicker, more nimble, and more fun to drive on public roads.

 

back to the height comment - although they look good short, I wish Ferrari would make there cars taller, that way i could fit in them.

 

The 914 is more fun to drive than my 308, but only in certain respects...I like interesting, beautiful and more exclusive cars over performance. Don't get me wrong, performance is very important with sports cars, and admittedly, my stable is a quite bit behind the times. Yet looks and lure rule...for performance wars will forever be a $ battle...unless you're strapping JATO bottles to the roof of your Chevy Nova.

 

Thats something Ive noticed too...I love nothing more than low, wide sports cars. Thats what gives an agressive look!

 

These days, a 914 in good shape is probably more exclusive than a 308! I can't remember the last time I saw one in the wild...

 

Thats funny. My neighbour drives a bright yellow one. I find it an odd little car.

 

NNO will be glad to know, between him and you you've just doubled the number of Enzo fans out there.
Brian C I have to disagree with you there, if there's one Ferrari that still looks perfect from all angles it's the 308, without a doubt one of the most distinctive shapes out there and the only one that has really defined what a Ferrari is over the past 30 years.

 

For me to gloat about it would be in bad form.

 

Hmmmm, i feel that way about the 360. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

 

Everyone agrees that lower and wider cars are cooler.
So it would be a no-brainer to make lower and wider cars right?
The truth is that many people with money are - well - big.
THEY WON'T FIT IN THE DAMN CAR!!! That's why Ferrari
is building bigger and taller cars.

 

The REAL truth is the USA is a LARGE market for Ferrari and over 60% of Americans are fat, with 30% being OBESE!

Truly sad

 

Imagine if Ferrari took the Lotus Elise concept to a new level. A small Lightweight car minimal creature comforts, say 2000-2300lb with a 355 type motor for under $100,000. The body can be grp or carbon for simplicity and minimal tooling requirements.

True the poseur crowd would not be interested but the drivers would. the future trend must include street legal trackable cars. In this sense Frerrari would be returning to its roots, a race type car you can drive to the track or have fun with on the right day on the right road. Because what we really want is a charismatic car with excellent performance and beauty of form.


If anyone doubts this formula, look at how well ducati have done in the motorcycle field.

 

Except for on the track, Ferraris do not and have never competed with other makes, with one arguable exception- the 512 TR vs the Countach/Diablo. After that, however, Ferrari returned to its understated chic roots. Think of it as the difference between an Armani suit and one from Versace et al. Armani, echoing the Neopolitan style, set the standard for men's couture. Everyone else followed, (think Calvin Klein), or distinguished themselves by being more flamboyant, (think Versace).

Ferrari has set the standard again and again in its own, distinct fashion. They've moved the ball several times, and only with the worldwide increase in population and wealth, has it now become profitable for others to compete in this niche of the automobile market. For Ferrari, however, it is only a matter of being more and more true to themselves, more Ferrari, while taking advantage of the latest machines and computer technologies to accomplish this goal.

As Zipj and Brian C. Stradale said earlier in this thread, the 612, 360 and 575M, as well as the Enzo, are Ferrari's roots.



Forza,

Cavallini

 

I can't see Ferrari ever going that far down-market...but that sounds like a good formula for Alfa Romeo to get back into contention as a sporting marque. The Elise has, it seems to me, defined a new market segment, and it doesn't really have any competitors there. And Alfa's post-war glory was built on zippy little race-cars-for-the-street.

 

Interesting. You qualified your question by confining it to "styling and design" rather than outright performance, and its in the latter area that i think ferrari have gone "soft." (Now, you might have intended, by the word "design" to mean more than just aesthetics, but i took your question to be about the overall look and shape of the car, rather than how it feels and performs).
I do think ferrari have gone looking for the comfort zone, the driver who needs to have his 360 accomodate his golf clubs, etc. I realize that, among the road cars, ferrari have traditionally made GTs, 2+2's and outright sporting machines, but even the more sporting cars-short of the limited production versions of the modern era starting with the 288GTO thru the Enzo--strike the balance differently than i think they should, for me. The 550, now the 575, is way too heavy, has body roll and while it also has ample torque, its a big hoagin to be haulin around in the squirrelies. Likewise, while i like the 360, it doesn't need to be as big or as heavy as it is; chuck the radio, power seats, etc. and get it down to fighting weight (which is why the CS exists, i suppose). I have long been a advocate for a decontented 12- the last one i owned that came close was a 512BBi and even that was a hefty focker. But, wouldn't it be nice, if just like in the old days, when you could buy your 250 as a cabrio, a california, as a 2+2 or as an alloy-bodied SWB, with outside filler cap and stripped down interior, you could, at both the 8cyl. and 12 cyl. levels, buy the animalistic version of each car?
There are alot of folks here who are not just driving their ferraris to restaurants; they are driving them hard, and are looking for the last iota of "hard-wired," being part of the machine, don't let the mod-cons like power steering, traction control, etc. get in the way of a visceral experience. In that way, i do think ferrari has gone soft, or at least doesn't offer its buyer the option of going "hard." When i got out of the Boxer after a several hours drive, i had worked hard; its not the same in the latest 12 cyl. production car. If i want to cruise, unruffled, across the continent, that's OK; but for spirited driving, i think what i am calling softness gets in the way.

 

I agree with all of the above. Performance is implicit in my formula, a really light car with a 355 type motor is really going to move. But is not about going faster than a enzo its more a matter of an enzo type formula simplified and more affordable. Maserati did a barachetta a few years back, but that was compromosed. The beauty of a Ferrari as opposed to an alfa is the whole feel, also the engine a true throughbread, after all a viper is fast too. Its about that strreet legal racecar with engineering refinement and beautiful looks.

So its all about a very nimble car not too heavy with more than "adequate" power. Think a more stylish better built and engineer3ed elise on steroids. The type of car you can build today can be faster and just as beaqutiful as a p4 or Dino racer. This is the type of car that would have been a killer on the track 15-20 years ago but can be beautiful, reliable and street legal now.

Its the origional Ferrari formula like a 250 swb the type of formula that existed before race and road dna became too separated. Look at the radical sr3 crude fast and ugly, or the noble, ferrari could do this so well using their off the shelf components..

If Ferrari built the real thing we could drive to the track have a real thrash and drive home, backroad weekends would be fun too. Probably such a car would be tiring on the highway and pack enough room for a toothbrush.

Even Toyota does this formula with its latest MR2. Ferrari could charge enough to do it prperly. Think baby enzo without the complexity. A lotus done by ferrari. The origional baracheta reborn in a modern mid engine formula.

How fast does such a car need to go, it doesnt need to beat a Enzo its for fun on the track, its that rcecar feel in a reliable street legal car. After all the most unrestrained fun you can really have driving these days is on a track and chewing up your 550/360 is always going to be a copromise and expensive. Frankly who cares whether it can drive to the shops, or has a roof.
Let the golf club set have their 360's give us the drivers car. True a 360cs does this but its big and expensive, while $100,000 aint cheap its workable.

Interestingly the next Mclaren will probaly be this car, an affordable F1.

Any ideas how to petition Ferrari?

 

You make it seem like the 308 is 35-40 years old....the oldest are 27-28 at best. Don't make me feel like an old man (25) !