328: Hot starting problem:

Do you mean the car cranks but won't fire or the car won't crank as the starter isn't turning the engine?
If the starter isn't turning the engine than it is getting heat soaked and it would be a good idea to rebuild it.

If it cranks but won't light then fuel pressure leak down. Usually in the Bosch Accumulator or Check Valve. It could be leaky injectors too but it is usually in the other 2.

 

I assume the starter is not turning the engine over....

See if your dome light goes off when you turn the switch to start (starter turns engine over). This would indicate a bad battery connection somewhere.

Try cleaning the battery posts and the attaching clamp.

In addition, there is a connector in the vicinity of the left headlight. It is a joint in one of the battery cables. About a year ago, my car began doing the same thing - intermittent no turn over with dome light going out or very dim when engine was being turned over. My plug was covered with oxide.

I cleaned the terminals and this connector. No more problem.

I have a 328.

 

I think most of these types of problems tend to be fuel related but since yours tends to jump start ok, it sounds more like the starter, I seem to remember something in the archives on hot starters, I would also double check next time it happens that in fact you are not getting spark

 

I had the same issue with my 328. The battery cable clamps expand differently than the battery posts. When the car was cold, the cable was tight. When the battery was warm, the cable was loose. The battery was fine, but the lamps would dim out when I turned the starter. At starter current levels, ohm's law does funny things.

I cleaned the clamp (and trimmed a bit of material to let it clamp tighter), and then coated the whole thing with electrolyte gel, and no more problem.

But a leaking check valve in the fuel pump is the textbook cause of cranks-but-won't-fire when warm syndrome.

 

Sounds like the typical starter solenoid problem.
They tend to deteriorate and when warm only works now and then, until they finally go totally south.
The starter is easily pulled from the left side through the wheel well.
In my case the solenoid was gone and could be replaced.
I chose, however to replace the entire starter motor, which includes the solenoid. Easy DYI project.

 

Do you hear the strong "clack" of the starter solenoid mechanism working and then the buzzing, or does it just buzz with no hard clack?

 

I checked the 328 SPC at FerrariUK, and (the bad news for you is that) it shows the same starter PN as a TR (120967) -- and TRs have this disease ("nada when warm") in spades. Go to the old site and do a search on "TR solenoid starter" (and mode, whole words) and you should get the relevant background threads. Bottom line is there were 2 solutions:

1. Adding another relay to put a strong +12V on the terminal 50 start command line of the solenoid (but not so great for the 328 starter location), or

2. Getting a fresh solenoid.

I opted for #2 (and it’s never missed a hot start since), but I can confirm that it also responded well to the #1 approach (using a screwdriver to short the +12V main line at the solenoid to the 50 terminal always got it to engage before I did the repair). No one ever posted a clear underlying reason why the problem happens, but I would guess that there’s a fracture in the magnet wire of the solenoid coil somewhere and that fracture gets pulled open when the coil pack gets warm and closes sufficiently to make contact when a bit cooler (but just speculation on my part, and not worth worrying about on a sub-$50 component). You can check your 328 solenoid for the stamped Bosch 10-digit PN to confirm that it matches the TR Bosch number given in those threads. Good luck with the fix (but, of course, please make your own diagnoses/decisions)…

 

The starter is a Bosch starter - can be had from any Bosch outlet.
Not at home, so I don't have the Bosch number here.
I do believe, however, that the Bosch number is mentioned either in
the Ferrri parts catalogue or the car manual.
Search the old threads here and something will show up.
This subject has been up frequently during the last couple of years.

 

The buzzing probably isn't the fuel pump. 328s have a safety switch in the AFM; until the car starts sucking air, the fuel pump doesn't run. (Unless the switch is out of alignment or shorted.)

Try turning on the headlights just before starting. If they go out completely (and the buzzing vanishes), then it's probably a bad connection.
If they stay full bright, then you're not getting current to the starter (solenoid issue).
If they dim (but don't go out), then your starter motor may be the issue.

 

I have heard of the mod....I would be inclined to fix it right...which is to get a new solenoid on your starter...with the time and labor to get it out, you might as well have the starter completely rebuilt. Though the starter/solenoid may be shared with the TR, I have not heard of hot start issues being common to the 328 series, unlike the TR.

Here's my rationale: You do the "remote solenoid" thing...it will work, I'm certain of that. A year or two later one of two things happen...your starter completely craps out, so now you are out another $1k anyway...or you decide to sell, and during the PPI, you have to explain all this extra wiring and crap that resides under the car....dunno....maybe I am all wrong (as "bigheaddennis" is inclined to say)

 

I don't see why you'd want to add the unneeded relay+wiring complexity, spend ~$250, and still maybe have an iffy starter solenoid when a new ~$35 Ace Electric Accurate 7-851 solenoid (+ labor) would be a much cleaner and simplier solution (and less labor).

The Ace Electric 7-851 starter solenoid is a direct replacement for the Bosch 0 331 303 032 starter solenoid used on your 328 (and my TR) starter.

PS If your symptom is "no clack", getting a complete starter (solenoid + motor) is unnecessary. If your symptom was "the clack occurs, but no starter motor cranking", then the starter motor would be suspect. JMOs -- and good luck limiting the damage ...

 

BTW SteveM, I'm saving that Ace part number for future reference...thanks!
(I hope I don't need it though...)

Dave

 

If you call the Atlanta distributor listed here:

http://www.aceelectric.com/Dist.htm

I'm sure that they can hook you up with a local retailer/rebuilder who can get you one. If you had to, you could order one from my Denver area source:

A-1 Auto Electric Company, Inc.
303-287-3347

Are you changing your plan? Isn't FoA going to do the work (and source the part)?

 

You may want to hook up a temporary remote starter switch/button with 12 gauge wire or better connected to the hot lead of the starter and then to the solenoid. Then the next time you try driving the car and it happens, try the remote starter. If the car starts then the solenoid is not getting enough voltage to engage, a typical hot start problem for F-Cars. If it doesn't start, then replace the starter and solenoid.

TR's, Mondials and other models have this problem. I believe that Ferrari even sells a wiring harness kit to provide a more constant source of power to the solenoid. The sell for about $350.00 and take about 2 hours to install.

 

hi heres my two cents and just an opinion
It sounds like a heat soaked solonoid, my race car has/had the same problem, and so do many others. My sujestion is to install a remote solonid like ford did on their firewall which dosent get heat soaked and will always for the most part work great. If thats somthing you wont concider then there is something else a starter heat blanket or shield on the market. However if you do go for the solonoid then purchase one from a ford dealer, their internals are more heavy duty so its worth the extra 10 dollars or so. the cheap one tend to fuse the contacts togther adn can cause a nasty fire/short everything happened to me.

 

Jim:

I still don't understand what the alarm had to do with the hot starting problem. How did the alarm directly affect the starting in hot temperatures?

My 348 Spider is having the same problems starting after being parked for 20-30 minutes in direct sun. Thanks for any info.

 

Sounds like problem i once had.
Theres a red plastic connector on the left rear that connects the main positive battery lead to a lead to the starter. If cracked you get a poor conection.

 

Lumberman,
Check this:
http://www.ferrariforum.net/tech/view.php?id=22

Or, you may also have a starter solenoid issue....