308 Rust & Restoration | FerrariChat

308 Rust & Restoration

Discussion in '308/328' started by DEI, Jan 8, 2005.

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  1. DEI

    DEI Karting

    Mar 21, 2004
    58
    London
    Full Name:
    Dave I
    Hi

    Advice sought:

    I am considering purchasing a fairly low milage 308 GTS from 79 with a good service history in the UK.

    However, the car has rust bubbles in the following places:
    A) Bottom of both doors
    B) Sill below the doors
    C) Lower body in front of rear wheel
    D) Rear corner, just above rear fibre glass valance

    Questions:
    1) How bad does this sound - or would it be normal?
    2) Would the rust likely to have spread to the floor plan and tubular frame
    3) Could this be fixed without replacement of pannels / major body restoration?
    4) How much would it cost?
    5) Any ideas of what companies in south east UK to contact to complete work?

    Any other ideas / advice?

    Thanks
    Dave
     
  2. sparta49

    sparta49 F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Mar 3, 2001
    7,802
    LA
    Full Name:
    Frank
    sounds about the right places
     
  3. DEI

    DEI Karting

    Mar 21, 2004
    58
    London
    Full Name:
    Dave I
    Thanks for the confirmation - but how normal is this and how difficult is it to put right? For example, are the pannels double skinned and what about the frame below the pannels?
     
  4. markh56

    markh56 Rookie

    Sep 7, 2004
    6
    Newport Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Mark Hurwitz
    Dave,

    I'll address a few of your concerns:

    1) How bad does this sound - or would it be normal?

    Rust is never a good sign and is always expensive to repair PROPERLY. A lot of times visible rust is just the tip of the iceberg. Since rust grows from the inside out, the damage can be extensive. The sill (if you're referring to the rocker panel) would be the worst of all 4 conditions, considering it is a structural part of the vehicle.

    2) Would the rust likely to have spread to the floor plan and tubular frame

    If you are talking about the rocker panel, the rust could have spread to these areas. I would highly suggest a autobody repairman (are they "panel beaters" in the UK?) view the car up on a lift before making a decision.

    3) Could this be fixed without replacement of pannels / major body restoration?

    I would call this major, considering that unless the rust is completely cut out, it will continue to spread. Don't forget the complete panel needs to be painted in order to be properly repaired (and possibly blending into adjacent panel(s) for accurate color match). If it is currently refinished in lacquer, you could spot the repaired area(s).

    4) How much would it cost?

    In the US, this type of repair would be done on an hourly basis and you could expect possibly about 100-120 hours, which includes assy/disassy.

    5) Any ideas of what companies in south east UK to contact to complete work?

    This could really add to your bottom line price if I recommend some shops here in Southern California :)

    Any other ideas / advice?

    Be careful and know what you're getting into before your purchase. It goes without saying that it's always better to purchase a garaged car without body corrosion, especially the less expensive a car is.

    Mark
     
  5. Jerrari

    Jerrari F1 Veteran

    Jul 24, 2001
    5,463
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Jerry Wiersma
    I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole unless you can "steal" it!!
     
  6. bert308

    bert308 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,776
    Roermond Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Bert Kanters
    Not true, the tubular frame is structural, the sill/rocker just supports the rear quarter panel. Non of the mentioned problem places are structural, just simple single steel plates as can be seen in my "project": (warning, not for the faint hearted) http://home.tiscali.nl/308gto/042.jpg.htm
    The floor is fiberglass by the way and the tubular frame is almost never affected. I think this car was in similar state, interesting reading: http://sky.prohosting.com/mcpd/Photos/respray/respray.htm
     
  7. markh56

    markh56 Rookie

    Sep 7, 2004
    6
    Newport Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Mark Hurwitz
    Bert,
    The rocker panel does do more than support the quarter panel. The first reason I referred to the rocker as a structural part is because on the GTS model, Ferrari reinforces the rocker to help prevent excessive body flex as opposed to the GTB (with it's roof) which wouldn't need the additional reinforcement. The second reason is because if the rocker needed to be replaced, the door opening gaps should be locked in place before cutting off the rocker to prevent any shifting of the body. When you replace a fender, door or quarter panel the body gaps do not have to be locked in place as there isn't any chance of the body shifting.
    And the floor pan is fiberglass as you stated; however there are many metal mounting points you don't want to be rusted out!
    Mark
     
  8. bert308

    bert308 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,776
    Roermond Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Bert Kanters
    I removed the quarter panel on mine and the rocker was just hanging in the air, the piece behind the door. I cut that of too and made a new one incorperated in the (gto-wider) new quarter panel.
    The metal mounting points in the floor are part of the solid frame. The GTS inforcements are visible when you open the door, a diagonal brace from the b-pillar to the horizontal part of the frame. The rockers are just thin sheet metal.
     
  9. DEI

    DEI Karting

    Mar 21, 2004
    58
    London
    Full Name:
    Dave I
    Guys many thanks - its all very sobering!
     
  10. DEI

    DEI Karting

    Mar 21, 2004
    58
    London
    Full Name:
    Dave I
    Bert

    Do you know who's car this was as I see that they are alos UK based and wouldn't mind finding out where the work was done and at what cost.

    I have been advised that it will cost £2k - £3k to let in fresh metal and repaint the lower part of the car and £3k - £4k to sort the rust and respray the whole car.

    This sounds fairly reasonable - any comments?

    Thanks
    Dave
     
  11. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,143
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    If you are shopping for the older carbed cars, it will be a VERY rare example that does not show some corrosion, at this point......

    The new sheet metal is a pretty easy fix, compared to mechanical issues.

    These are pretty typical for a '70s 308GTB/S.
     
  12. DEI

    DEI Karting

    Mar 21, 2004
    58
    London
    Full Name:
    Dave I
    Big Tex, thanks for the insights.

    I have just spoken to a few more companies and it looks like about £5k will sort out the rust (letting in new metal) and give the car a full respray.

    Comments?
     
  13. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,143
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Well, there ARE "unrusty" ones still out there.......

    It's more of a graduated scale between "I've stored this car for you for the last 25 years. Here it is....pay me"

    and.....

    "Well it has been driven in the rain."

    I drive mine....I fix the rust as it comes. None of my GTBs have the extent shown in the "horror" thread. The GTSs obviously offer lots more moisture in to the car.......

    Us GTB owners refer to the roof hatch as the "optional water leak"...if there's not big money being allowed off the 'ask' price, I'd look for one without the problems. You want to be sure YOU are not the one upside down on value at the end of the day.

    Poke around a little more and make SURE of what you have there....
     
  14. bert308

    bert308 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,776
    Roermond Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Bert Kanters
    This is the main page from that site with not only a picture from the guy but also contact info: www.redmist.freeserve.co.uk . He is a regular poster at newsgroup alt.autos.ferrari
     

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