F50 Engine not punchy enough | FerrariChat

F50 Engine not punchy enough

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by yimn, Jan 9, 2005.

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  1. yimn

    yimn Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    156
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Nick Yim
    I bought a 1996 F50 wtih 300km six months ago. A thorough service was done right after and everything seems normal except that I don't feel the engine is punchy enough even at high REV. Initially, I thought the engine needs to be run in as it got basically no milage on it but even after 1000km, it still feels a bit tight and torque-less.

    I recently checked the compression of the engine and it is perfect on all 12 cyclinders. The dealer aslo checked everything that can be checked with their computer SD2 and all are normal. I was wondering what else I should look to identify problems. The service manager said I might be too sensitive but I drove my friend's F50 a couple times and the engine just feels a lot more pushy and powerful. Any suggestion will be welcome. thanks
     
  2. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,477
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    How many miles on your friend's F50? And how much difference did you feel? Could be the difference on how hard (or soft) it was treated during the break in period.
     
  3. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
    14,518
    FL
    My only guess would be the fact that the car has ran so little over an 8-9 year period. How many miles does your friend's F50 have? And for that matter, how did he break in his engine? How did you break in your engine (i.e. under 4k RPM for 1,200 miles, then increase RPM by 500 for every addition 500 miles).

    I don't know how you prepped the engine to start for the first time in a while, but the oil might have all gone down to the bottom of the engine (the oil probably should've been replaced anyways if you didn't do it). Something bad could've happened the first time you started, but I don't know. Please keep us updated with any progress you get.
     
  4. ferrarifixer

    ferrarifixer F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Jul 22, 2003
    8,520
    Melbourne
    Full Name:
    Phil Hughes
    Well, of course theres always the cam timing debate again.....

    Then there's things like old stale fuel and/or bad fuel filters

    Or even something silly like not getting full throttle...when you pull an F50 engine off, the trickiest bit is the throttle cable, it's easy to not set it up right.

    Could be a blocked cat or two,

    binding brakes also a possiblity.

    What about your friends car...is it std, does it have a tubi, or no cats or other mod...even just some race air filters will make a noticable difference.....

    Maybe you have a misfire...are the spark plugs new/good??

    Rule out as much as possible, then go to the cam timing is my suggestion.
     
  5. Ken

    Ken F1 World Champ

    Oct 19, 2001
    16,078
    Arlington Heights IL
    Full Name:
    Kenneth
    This needs to be quantified. I'd dyno the car and see exactly what you have. I'd dyno your friend's car at the same time if you can and compare. This might lend a clue of where to look if the numbers do indeed show a problem.

    Wild guess from a Lotus guy: exhaust restriction?

    Ken
     
  6. Artherd

    Artherd F1 Veteran

    Jun 19, 2002
    6,588
    Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ben Cannon
    Throttle cables are a trick on the F50 for some reason.

    Get the cars both dyno'd.
     
  7. rexrcr

    rexrcr Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 27, 2002
    1,578
    Kalamazoo, MI
    Full Name:
    Rob Schermerhorn
    Agreed. Calibrate the @ss-O-meter.
     
  8. yimn

    yimn Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    156
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Nick Yim
    I have changed the spark plug and air filter. Don't know if the ful filter is changed. My friend's car has about 9000km and was driven pretty hard. Please elaborate on the cam timing and throttle cable isses.
     
  9. yimn

    yimn Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    156
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Nick Yim
    What is the @ss-O-meter???
     
  10. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
    14,518
    FL
    Butt-dyno, dynamometer.
     
  11. LetsJet

    LetsJet F1 Veteran
    Owner

    May 24, 2004
    9,334
    DC/LA/Paris/Haleiwa
    Full Name:
    Mr.
    Does the ECU computer register driving style in the F50? Should it be reset then run hard? Maybe the former owner babied it?
     
  12. rexrcr

    rexrcr Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 27, 2002
    1,578
    Kalamazoo, MI
    Full Name:
    Rob Schermerhorn
    Yes, the ECU does "learn" to a certain extent. That said, sometimes an ECU reset is a quick and easy test, though usually doesnt' get you much result, though doesn't hurt anything either.

    However, the main issue here is we can't drive this car over the internet. I could tell you in one run through the gears whether it's making average F50 power. I'd be less expensive to find either an experience F50 technician living close to the owner, and/or a chassis dynamometer (even better solution). With the F50, you'll not have any ECU issues like sensing the front wheels not turning and pulling back the ignition timing to avoid overheating, etc. like most modern engine management systems do.

    Rob
     
  13. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    It's hard to tell driving one and then driving another one. I'd guess throttle cable isn't right. I have never found these cars to be very peppy until they come on the cam (High Revs) I'd also make sure your tach is calabrated. If it's reading high you may not be reving high enough.
    Best
     
  14. reytech

    reytech Rookie

    Oct 6, 2008
    17
    Baltimore
    Full Name:
    Rey
    I and working in a 1996 F50; i replaced the dashboard harness and after that only the bank (engine cylinder 7-12) is working.
    i did swaped the ECU's and still the same.
    the pin #34 in the ECU send the ground signal to activate the fuel pump relay, but the passenger side ECU is not sending that ground signal; check for fuses and relay all ok?
    any ideas.
    by the way as soon as i key to possition 2 (not starting the car) the slow down warning light comeout; and cehck ciliders 1-6
     
  15. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

    May 17, 2006
    12,755
    Dallas, Tx.
    Full Name:
    James K. Woods
    Could you post the serial number of that car, Reytech?
     
  16. The Kook Abides

    The Kook Abides F1 Rookie

    Jan 4, 2011
    3,459
    When the throttle pedal is put to the floor, make sure the butterflies are wide open. i.e cable slack.
     
  17. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,620
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    ARISE !!!!!!!!

    Come up out of your 7 year slumber.
     
  18. spaghetti_jet

    spaghetti_jet Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2005
    947
    Europa
    Full Name:
    Bob
    This thread has probably done more miles than the car in the op over the last 7 years!
     

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